Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

[KiDo_Tuning]

I never wanted to leave my TP tune kieran, I don't know where you heard that? It was great and I logged the car for 1.5weeks, 30min to an hour every day of logging and car runs great - check out the maf scaling and my knock LV. 150kms in all driving conditions except heavy rain and car looks great.

The only reason I went to matt was because he offered me a free dyno to fix the issues he couldn't fix before. So I agreed. I thought it'd help him clear his rep on here? I don't know what to think anymore

As for the 4.20 knock on the tp tune, it was only in one load range...and the knock ears on the dyno were clean so until I go to cihan or msr I'm happy with erics tune. The knock shouldn't be piston knock. I'm taking the car in to get a full check done on the 27th but nothing points to a major mechanical problem.

And logging the car was the fist thing I did and sent 30 mins worth of clean logs to eric.

Not sure why you would post implying im stupid and hoping for magic, but I can assure you my problems really appeared on the dyno tune not on TP tune. Not saying it's the tune but the evidence so far, if you read my posts properly again, points to one thing.

Matt I've asked you for a copy of the tune twice now, day after the dyno (the 6th) and yesterday and today is the 15th - still waiting mate? What I pulled off my ecu is corrupt for some reason...

My rpm and load ranges are in narrower bands. You have knock in the same rpm and load regions, mine is spread out more which is why IAM drops faster since after 0.75, it drops straight to zero to ccount for either poor fuel or excessive knock sensor noise like has been discussed before and disables boost

Erics tune pulled timing on the dyno after we reset your ECU, doing the first run knock free was because timing was being pulled already in Learning View. Hence why you had two base runs

You will also notice that the auto gearbox is/was not slipping with the right requested torque values(hence the total lock up in 1st gear which may account for the FLKC being recorded). Just like an Audi/VW or the SST Mitsubishi gearboxes, if the DBW values are not right the auto does not apply enough pressure on the auto and it slips so at say xrpm your doing 60kph but double your rpm your doing 150kph(not 120kph), which is a mechanical gearing impossibility so the dyno adds 20+% more power as the roller rpm is higher so the real power output is closer to the power recorded at 4800rpm Seen plenty of dyno tunes on autos where gearbox slips affects peak power outputs when the rpm and roller speed axis do not line up... even on the same car with different parts fitted having a different axis

Not sure why it would be corrupt, since I was on wifi for last few days I want to confirm it is not corrupt in a hex editor

[Kekotic]

Not sure why you would post implying im stupid and hoping for magic, but I can assure you my problems really appeared on the dyno tune not on TP tune. Not saying it's the tune but the evidence so far, if you read my posts properly again, points to one thing.

Sorry Alexei I was not implying anything of the sort.
I honestly believed the reason you went back to Matt was because the TP tune was having similar issues.

[Ric]

-removed

[alexeiwoody]

My rpm and load ranges are in narrower bands. You have knock in the same rpm and load regions, mine is spread out more which is why IAM drops faster since after 0.75, it drops straight to zero to ccount for either poor fuel or excessive knock sensor noise like has been discussed before and disables boost

Your rpm values and load values are narrower yes, if you have a look at the LV I posted again your load regions are almost identical, except that Eric's second last range goes from 2-5 and yours goes 2-2.30. Notice how TP tune has no knock above 1.64g/rev, (because as you would agree, the -0.70 has been recognised as noise) while your tune has knock all the way to the end. I'll repost the LV's again below - because I can't believe you actually posted that matt. The pictures are there very clearly showing less knock...you're welcome to check again

If there is a mechanical problem there, and there probably is (you, Eric and I all agree), it became worse on the second LV as you can see

You will also notice that the auto gearbox is/was not slipping with the right requested torque values(hence the total lock up in 1st gear which may account for the FLKC being recorded). Just like an Audi/VW or the SST Mitsubishi gearboxes, if the DBW values are not right the auto does not apply enough pressure on the auto and it slips

You're saying my auto was slipping at 148kwaw? Like 20 kw above stock, and it was already slipping?

That's equivalent of saying the gearbox slips at stock levels. Surely the good tuners at Subaru aren't THAT silly. You did tell me during the road tune the imprezza sti auto is tuned the right way.

And why have I never felt it slip. On any of the eric's tunes or yours - it's the same. When a gearbox slips - it's pretty obvious on a 150kwaw car at WOT. Again matt, can't believe you posted that. (Btw Daniel at RTR said the transmission was slipping on your tune, after you had finished tuning on the dyno - contradicting everything you just posted.)

Not sure why it would be corrupt, since I was on wifi for last few days I want to confirm it is not corrupt in a hex editor

You still to this moment haven't sent me a copy of the tune...


LV's again

Torqued Performance tune

LearningView_SS_05-02-2013 3 58 30 pm.jpg (74.95 KiB) Viewed 3400 times

Kido tune

LearningView_SS_10-02-2013 1 59 53 pm.jpg (75.39 KiB) Viewed 3400 times

[Kekotic]

Not trying to start anything here Alexei just saying. When I was watching your dyno, Dan from RTR actually said to us both he could feel the transmission slipping. And he was the one driving it.

I'm not going to comment on any of the other stuff being said here, but just saying I do recall Dan saying that at the time. Whether or not it's true we will find out eventually! Hope you get to the bottom of all this soon.

[alexeiwoody]

Sorry Alexei I was not implying anything of the sort.
I honestly believed the reason you went back to Matt was because the TP tune was having similar issues.

It's alright mate, you were trying to help

Not trying to start anything here Alexei just saying. When I was watching your dyno, Dan from RTR actually said to us both he could feel the transmission slipping. And he was the one driving it.

I'm not going to comment on any of the other stuff being said here, but just saying I do recall Dan saying that at the time. Whether or not it's true we will find out eventually! Hope you get to the bottom of all this soon.

Yep Dan said that on all the tunes, erics and matts. He's probably referring to the hesitation at 5000rpm. But it grips back in straight after 5000 - which points away from tranny slipping. Matt and I decided it's electrical related, spark, coils, battery maybe. Ordered parts already.

Matt says the car doesn't slip on his tune, because of the extra requested torque. Dan says it slips on anything. But the car doesn't lose pull on the road on any of the two tunes. Dan never drove it on the road. Ask matt or take a drive in my car - it doesn't slip.

[<GB>]

This slip are u guys talking in the clutch packs? Or the lock out torque converter slip?

[Kekotic]

Yep Dan said that on all the tunes, erics and matts. He's probably referring to the hesitation at 5000rpm. But it grips back in straight after 5000 - which points away from tranny slipping. Matt and I decided it's electrical related, spark, coils, battery maybe. Ordered parts already.

The fact that you were able to receive a corrupted ROM from your own ECU possibly* does indicate there is something wrong electrically with the car. Compounded by your weird logging cut outs etc. Honestly if I was in your position I would be scared to flash the car just in case But you seem to be doing alright with a lot of flashes so I guess no issue there.

[<GB>]

The tp lv view ranges for engine speed could be changed have u asked him why it's set to 12000rpm?

[bass_straitener]

The tp lv view ranges for engine speed could be changed have u asked him why it's set to 12000rpm?

Those are the stock tune settings.

[Kekotic]

The tp lv view ranges for engine speed could be changed have u asked him why it's set to 12000rpm?

Those are the stock tune settings.

Why bother keeping those? Wouldn't it be more beneficial to see which rpm ranges are pulling timing?
I guess you can see them in logging for the real rpm and conditions, but still. Seems like a waste with those unused tables?

[alexeiwoody]

The fact that you were able to receive a corrupted ROM from your own ECU possibly* does indicate there is something wrong electrically with the car. Compounded by your weird logging cut outs etc. Honestly if I was in your position I would be scared to flash the car just in case But you seem to be doing alright with a lot of flashes so I guess no issue there.

Logging only drops out when you WOT from say 2 or 3k rpm and hold it to redline. That could possibly point to the battery not giving charge fast enough, or having bad engine ground or maybe in some weird way coil packs. But it's only under those conditions, otherwise car's smooth as to drive and in logs. Anyway I'll replace the parts to narrow it down to what it really is.

As for the corrupt ROM - uh...yeah it's a mystery, let's hope it wasn't like that on the ecu.

And GB, eric said he will not change the rpm ranges. He said it's to protect the engine even more in case of any knock and that this is the safer way to tune.

When you have more rpm ranges during tuning - you're giving the engine more chances to knock, and it's a big price to pay just so you can have a nicer looking LV.

[Kekotic]

When you have more rpm ranges during tuning - you're giving the engine more chances to knock, and basically it's a small price to pay just so you can have a nicer looking LV.

Alright I totally don't get it?

Bruce or someone can you explain what this means?

Are you saying that the ECU is given more FLKC options when you tighten the rpm ranges? or something along those lines?

[<GB>]

I'm not sold on what Eric says sorry, his a/f learning is pulling fuel when in open loop... 40+That's not cool

[Kekotic]

I'm not sold on what Eric says sorry, his a/f learning is pulling fuel when in open loop... 40+That's not cool

Why is the D range at 40+?