ez30 extractors

Posts specific to the 3.0 litre NA H6 engine

Re: ez30 extractors

Postby Robbks » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:31 am

kiks wrote:So where can I buy a kit set of extractors that comes with plastic bags with all the nuts, and descriptions for which direction to turn them?

jzk25 wrote:The fact is that the factory headers are perfectly fine and suited to the cams, that's why no significant power increase is available from the engine from std. The factory cats are in fact the biggest restriction in any Gen 4 exhaust system.


I'd take this advice
and after some discussions with both Al and others will be doing just that.
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby smythie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:36 am

jzk25 wrote:
smythie wrote:And up until your paragraph admitting to the headers being too noisy for compliance (and subsequently being modified), you have allowed others to give you credit for those headers and the conversion you did on his car (which aside from the exhaust I reckon was a good job by the way - I have not said anything different about that car). By not disclosing the fact that the finished system was not wholly yours (and you've been around long enough to do so), you have taken the credit for the work yourself. If you are going to take credit for the positives about a car, you had better be prepared to accept responsibility for the negatives.

Another reason I have been disappointed with the work coming out of your workshop was a dodgy front mount installation on a Gen 2. In the process of cutting reinforcing behind the front bar you left a sharp edge to later cut through the silicone elbow coming of the intercooler. When we found the reason it wouldn't build boost during a roadside repair after the owner got tired of it on a cruise we were able to fit a couple of fingers through the cut in the elbow.

If the reputation of your business is important enough to you that you search around forums for negative remarks, your focus should be on getting cars right first not getting upset when dodgy work comes back to haunt you.


Would the pierced intercooler hose have been on a car that had a front end shunt by any chance?

It's great that you have two examples of random cars that have probably done 20k kms since they were at the workshop that have had "catastrophic" failures and therefore you can judge my work upon that.
Who said anything about catastrophic failures? :lol:

Nope, what I saw was not the result of a front end shunt. The car may have been in one at some point (just as yours or mine may have - I didn't run over it with a fine tooth comb looking for evidence of impact damage, though there was none in the area of the front bar) but the fault was the workmanship of your shop which performed the front mount installation. I won't disclose any more about the owner of the car as the owner does not deserve you yelling down the phone to them about daring to mention to people who were performing a roadside fix on the car that it was your workshop that did the installation.

And a sharp edged piece of (2-3mm thick) steel rubbing a silicone hose at near right angles to the surface of the hose (the hose was around 8mm thick fwiw) is rarely going to be an issue for the car in its first couple of weeks out of the shop. It is months and thousands of km's down the track that it will become an issue. It seems that you build cars to be safe and reliable for the long haul going by the supporting comments you have received in this thread over the weekend. This one was not. Hopefully (for your shop and your past and future customers) I've just seen the one bad example and there are thousands of very good examples done and yet to come.

jzk25 wrote:You are truly awesome and should never leave the internet as it is your natural home.
Why thank you. You're doing pretty well at it yourself.

jzk25 wrote:I came here to see how much of an ass Ian had made of himself being a forum warrior(it's his profession) and find some local legend dropping comments about a workshop he has no knowledge of apart from some random well used cars that have previously been worked on by us.
And yet you couldn't be arsed doing something to diffuse those threads where Ian went over the top, particularly when he was talking about your work as reference. Instead, you lurked for months before taking a shot at me because I had the gall to criticise your work based on evidence I had seen (including some which you refused to correct which lead to a seemingly incorrect conclusion in the case of one car). So far you've proven yourself to be a pretty good forum warrior in the space of a couple of days.

jzk25 wrote:Tell me all about yourself Smythie. You must be an experienced man in the automotive industry to make such sweeping judgements with no basis?
What sweeping judgements? Statements of fact. I have seen some dodgy work that has come out of your workshop. FACT. And until you confessed that the full exhaust was not your work, your taking credit for it allowed the statement I made at the start of the thread AT THE TIME OF WRITING to also be FACT. If you or your mate smoov had bothered at the time to pipe up and say something along the lines of "The headers as you see them there were mine but I know the exhaust system has been modified a few times since" I would have happily apologised and retracted the statement. Instead, you defended the exhaust as your own work and only after being told a second time that they leaked did you try to distance yourself from what you think may have been the issue.

A sweeping judgement would have been "AMAuto can't build a long term reliable car"

With the benefit of the further information you have finally provided, I apologise to AMAuto and anyone else offended for the statement that I made early in this thread regarding leaks in an exhaust system.

I also apologise for this statement from earlier in the thread, just in case it may be perceived as defammatory towards your shop:
they're pretty basic for sure but following the route all 3 pipes on each side take it is evident that they tried to get as even length as possible. Not elegant, but they achieved it as well as the nicer looking example you provided a pic of
I thought it was a statement in defence of the shop but now I'm not so sure it would have been seen that way by the owner and their supporters
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby smythie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 11:04 am

smoov wrote:
smythie wrote:Re-read my earlier posts again and you will see that I supported the design of Al's headers when criticised for not being equal length.

Sorry. I didn't see any "support" on your behalf. All I saw was this, this and this. Hardly what anybody with half a brain would call "support". More like "libel".
Fact, fact (at the time of writing - see my previous reply to Al for more information) and fact. No libel at all. Maybe unfortunate truth for you and Al, Mike and co however. Is this also libel?

smoov wrote:
smythie wrote:More than happy to catch up and perv at your car sometime smoov. Keep an eye out for Sydney gatherings, I'll be along if I'm in town

Groovy. Since this place has such a positive and supportive vibe, I'll keep my eyes peeled, and try my best for the next meet.... how about you PM me when you're next in town... may be easier for the both of us?
I appreciate that my ending comments in that post may have looked sarcastic to you but the fact is that they were not. I'm in town now until the afternoon of the 14th then will be out of town until mid-late April with work with the odd weekend back here at home


smoov wrote:
smythie wrote:Al, thank you also for finally contributing. I'm sure most would welcome you hanging around and contributing more.

Wow. Not only do you turn around one hundred and eighty degrees with your tail between your legs, but you have the arrogance to maintain face.

Very welcoming.
It was a genuine statement. I had said my piece earlier in the post and rather than continue on in an attempt to make an enemy for life, I attempted to do what no-one else in this thread had bothered to do, yourself included: welcome the man to the forum.

In the midst of attacking those he thought were attacking him he had the generosity to make some genuine helpful recommendations for those who bothered to read through all of his comments and not judge him based on his first couple of posts in this forum. If the positive remarks his shop has received are anything to go by he has some good knowledge that I'm sure many would benefit from. At the very least, maintaining a presence in here would make it easier for some SE Qlders to get in contact with him regarding booking in for some work.

Finally, the comment was not directed at you and Al didn't make comment on it positive or negative in his rebuttal - your insulting response was not only redundant but also reflected negatively on yourself and Al.
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby jzk25 » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:18 pm

Can't we all just get along. :)

Here's some EZ30 headers that will increase power.

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And some earlier versions that also increased power.

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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby Kekotic » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:27 pm

Man the piping in that first picture looks so ghetto, no doubt it works though.
Also a massive turbo, bet that takes a while to spool up :lol:

Is this your car or just some random pics on the net?
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby smythie » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:30 pm

:D I bet they do

Is this the build to which Ian referred a little while ago?
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby 988OXR » Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:15 pm

Theres a difference between something that looks shit and something that doesn't perform. As for the size of the turbo, all of AMAutos customers tell the guys what they want. Nics car (the rex) has been going on for quite a while and if i can remember Nic the few times I've met him, the car is getting built for drag/dyno queen status.


The photos below that are of a Gen 2 that Ian was talking about. The tailshaft snapped after a call to 'Dump it". It was funny. Once we put another tailshaft in (courtesy of moi) the car pulled 300kw at 15psi IIRC.

Al, me thinks you should frequent this forum a bit more with the builds you do so people can see what really goes on at the workshop. Think it would be the best thing to minimise any negativity that there is about you or the business.

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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby Kekotic » Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:19 pm

988OXR wrote:Theres a difference between something that looks shit and something that doesn't perform.

Well that's exactly what my post said isn't it :D

I would like to know more about what workshop you guys are talking about etc....
clearly there is a lot of between the lines stuff going on which people like me that are not in the know cannot understand.
Please feel free to post whatever you please, as I personally love seeing this stuff.
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby kiks » Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:23 pm

Why does it matter if it takes a while to spool, people dont understand the fact that such a large turbo makes the engine so much more efficient off boost. It's no longer trying to breathe through a straw at 2+:1 exhaust to intake pressure ratios. The 1.5<:1 of a big turbo makes more power off boost than a little turbo does at low boost simply because the whole system isnt throttled by effectivly a 1 inch exhaust.

That extra half a second it took to get to 4000 rpm is offset by the fact its 7000 by the time the little turbo's donk is at 5000rpm. These aren't diesel engines :p Anything over 1:1 exhaust to intake is costing power, response, fuel economy. Doubt you'll find a single car on this forum that is under 2:1.

Knowledge 101 @ volumetric efficiency on a turbo.

980OXR can probably attest to the fact that below setup will pull strongly in any gear from 1000rpm. It's a well known car to select people. Just not an internet showpony. "the car pulled 300kw at 15psi IIRC" 330 at 18.
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby Kekotic » Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:38 pm

kiks wrote:Why does it matter if it takes a while to spool, people dont understand the fact that such a large turbo makes the engine so much more efficient off boost.

Far out dude, it was a joke...
Get over it
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby 988OXR » Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:53 pm

kiks wrote:
980OXR can probably attest to the fact that below setup will pull strongly in any gear from 1000rpm. It's a well known car to select people. Just not an internet showpony. "the car pulled 300kw at 15psi IIRC" 330 at 18.



The clutch was a prick to use but the drive from Canberra back home to Queensland was good.

As for Nics car, can see there would be massif amounts of turbo lag due to the nature of all that pipework between the motor and turbo. :roll:
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby kiks » Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:26 pm

Yeah that 3788 on a low mount manifold and twin scroll housing would be heaps laggy I agree :p
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby Kekotic » Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:44 pm

Okay clearly I'm not mechanically minded.
I was just posting a joke with my lack of turbo knowledge, because that turbo looked huge I assumed it would have 'lag'.
My idea of a turbo is, the bigger it is, the longer it takes to 'wind up'.....that's the only reason I made the joke because that turbo looks enormous.
Obviously I have a lot to learn, but I was literally just trying to comment on how big the thing looked....nothing to do with position or pipework or anything like that, because I don't know about any of that.
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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby jzk25 » Mon Feb 07, 2011 7:23 pm

The turbo is a GT3788 which is a step above a GT35R. It's around the size of a TO4Z but uses modern design where the TO4Z is an older garrett with ballbearing conversion.
This is not a big turbo for a built 3l engine, it is a very good size. Full boost would come around 4000rpm.
The exhaust manifolding is a one off at this stage. We have been experimenting with lowmounting large turbos to reduce the piping length and associated heatloss which is the main cause of lag in subarus.

The stainless manifolds on the bottom pic have been removed and will be replaced with a similiar setup when time allows and the engine is fitted to a gen3(more frontal space than a gen 2.

The piping looks like it does because it is mild steel. It is 3mm thick to retain heat and give rigidity. Stainless steel may look pretty(for a short time) but it not ideal for turbo manifolds as it becomes brittle with use and is more prone to failure around the welds as a result of the welding process unless it is purge welded which is prohibitively expensive.

We have also built a few EJ25 lowmounts including the pipes fitted to one of the best WRX's in the world.

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This is the T3 version(not twinscroll). This is much more practical to produce and package.

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Re: ez30 extractors

Postby kiks » Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:06 pm

exhaust isnt even welded on nicks car... no wonder they leak.
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