TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby Ric » Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:04 pm

lump_a_charcoal wrote:...
I bought it about 6 weeks ago. It will wig wag when the car is off, but not when it's on.

I believe that is how it is supposed to work.
i.e. same as factory while the car is running.

Are you saying that, with the car off, I turn on hazards, indicate left, and that will enable wig wag whilst driving?

No. I don't believe the unit will do wig-wag while you are driving. That's probably to keep everything legal.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby jakey » Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:20 pm

Ric wrote: That's probably to keep everything legal.



Also to stop you being a douche in traffic haha
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby lump_a_charcoal » Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:27 pm

Ric wrote:
lump_a_charcoal wrote:...
I bought it about 6 weeks ago. It will wig wag when the car is off, but not when it's on.

I believe that is how it is supposed to work.
i.e. same as factory while the car is running.

Are you saying that, with the car off, I turn on hazards, indicate left, and that will enable wig wag whilst driving?

No. I don't believe the unit will do wig-wag while you are driving. That's probably to keep everything legal.


Pretty sure I saw it as a listed feature. Ricco has it on his Lib also.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby db1 » Fri Aug 16, 2013 5:26 pm

scottmcphee wrote:[*]Programmable setting to restrict or enable use of new hazard flash modes while ignition is on, in other words, while driving. (The new modes are always available when ignition is off, while parked.)I


I belive it's a setting that is disabled by default.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby scottmcphee » Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:56 pm

It's okay you have a modern unit. Wig wag in motion is disabled by default.

You can change that and set it up for wig wag while driving. Here's how:

Start car.
Signal right. Keep it there.
Hazards on.
Shut off car.

Now you can wig wag parked, and while driving. Check your local laws.

To reset Tapturn do similar procedure as above, but signal stalk in left position instead. That puts everything back to how you received the unit, factory fresh!

Cheers
Last edited by scottmcphee on Sat Aug 17, 2013 2:57 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby scottmcphee » Sat Aug 17, 2013 2:19 am

lump_a_charcoal wrote:I take it you are talking about a LHD vehicle, because our stalks go down to turn right.


Oh boy, everything in Australia really IS UPSIDEDOWN!

You know, I drove in UK on the wrong (er, left) side of the road just this past Christmas and everything was so intuitive to me (I'm a switch hitter) that I didn't even notice where the signal stalk was.

If it's true and you're not bullshitting me and the stalk really is on the right side of the steering wheel (pls confirm!) then any up/down wording in the Tap Turn instructions are ass backwards for you guys. Sorry about that.. but I do also say "right and left" in the instructions. Follow the right / left wording and ignore the up/down wording and everything should be OK.

I guess there's a cognitive bias in the design for LHD vehicles, in the area of changing the blink count: the notion of tapping "up" to increase the count is more intuitive than tapping "down" to increase. In any case, you are "tapping RIGHT" to increase.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby Ric » Sat Aug 17, 2013 7:48 am

scottmcphee wrote:...
You know, I drove in UK on the wrong (er, left) side of the road just this past Christmas and everything was so intuitive to me (I'm a switch hitter) that I didn't even notice where the signal stalk was.

If it's true and you're not bullshitting me and the stalk really is on the right side of the steering wheel (pls confirm!)
.....


What car did you have in the UK?
Many Euro cars keep the stalk on the left, even in a RHD model.

Here in Australia, most Australian built and Japanese built are on the right. Euro built cars could be either.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby lump_a_charcoal » Sat Aug 17, 2013 8:08 am

OK I think I know why I couldn't get your instructions to work now! hahaha

I'll give it a try, thanks for the help!
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby jakey » Fri Sep 06, 2013 12:15 am

Hey Scott just wondering if you've ever thought about a fast wig wag? (like tow trucks and emergency vehicles have?) is there a technical reason or just never implemented? I think it would be a good idea for tap turn 2.0 :-)
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby scottmcphee » Fri Sep 06, 2013 1:00 am

jakey wrote:Hey Scott just wondering if you've ever thought about a fast wig wag? (like tow trucks and emergency vehicles have?) is there a technical reason or just never implemented? I think it would be a good idea for tap turn 2.0 :-)


Do you mean speed up the clock x 2, so you'd get wig wag going back and forth twice as fast.

I've also had people ask if a strobe (double pulse per side) is possible, not only for wig wag, but for all things - signaling included. So for anywhere you'd see a blink on a signal light, you'd get a strobe instead.

The main reasons for not wanting to get too quick on the blinks are two-fold: incandescent lamps (stock bulbs) are sluggish, and Tapturn uses relays to drive load - which are mechanical devices so they're slow too, and speeding things up wears out the contacts faster. Both of these negatives relate to stock bulbs mostly.

If you're running LED bulbs things change a bit. You've got instant on light, and the load is so slight that relay contact wear is negligible. SO it makes sense you can drive features faster if you have LED's. Loads of people who buy Tapturn do have LED's.

Also keep in mind one of the big benefits of Tapturn is that it solves the hyperblink problem of dropping LED's into the car signals. (Some people actually like the hyperblink and keep the stock flasher to get their speedy blinks that way, great!)
But generally, blink too fast and things start looking like hyperblink which looks like "you have a problem with your signals" and is something people instinctively want to get rid of.

For all these reasons it makes sense to me to offer weird blinky features for hazards, and not signaling. Keep signaling steady 90cpm or so. Speeding up the hazard modes (strobes or faster wig wag) make sense for LED's only.

A constant challenge is not filling up the user interface space with too many features to make it hard to remember how to use features. Having the easter egg that's in there now (slow wig wag) is already pushing the limits of usability, that's why I don't advertise it as a feature but still hang it out there if you're crafty enough to find and use good for you.

I'll dream on these things... thanks for the suggestions.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby lump_a_charcoal » Fri Sep 06, 2013 6:44 am

My suggestion for 2.0 would be random flashing on all 4 corners.
Again, probably not possible, but it would be cool as I think.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby RX25SE » Fri Sep 06, 2013 12:43 pm

For v2.0 I would like to see a slightly longer 'tap' time.
I find I hold it for a little too long, so I only get a single flash.

Having said that, maybe I just need to get used to it.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby scottmcphee » Fri Sep 06, 2013 1:27 pm

RX25SE wrote:For v2.0 I would like to see a slightly longer 'tap' time.
I find I hold it for a little too long, so I only get a single flash.

Having said that, maybe I just need to get used to it.


You'll get used to being very brief on the tap to set it off..

Right now things are programmed so you must release the tap before the first blink expires. Which is about one third of a second of contact maximum to be considered a tap. Holding any amount longer than that puts you in control and it will blink for as long as it's held, stopping as soon as you release.

I've experimented with having a longer allowable tap: 2/3 second, or up to the beginning of the second blink. So this would allow the first blink to finish and you could release in the dark zone between the first and second blinks and still have it considered a tap that touches off a sequence. The downside of this arrangement is that it becomes impossible to do just a single crisp blink if that is all you wanted. You'd only be able to do one and a fraction blinks.

Long story short, the way it is now you can control getting one, two, three, or more blinks out when you want and conditions warrant. You can't do that on a VW! Minimum two blinks. Whereas a Mitsubishi Lancer behaves more like Tapturn, it is possible to get a single blink out of a Lancer because it's tap release is same as Tapturn. So it differs by brand.
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby scottmcphee » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:03 am

People must be reading these posts... I keep selling to Australia / area ... like you guys must be my 2nd biggest export country, after my neighbour to the south USA.

Good on ya!
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Re: TapTurn flasher - convenience signaling for Liberty

Postby scottmcphee » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:08 am

scottmcphee wrote:I'll dream on these things... thanks for the suggestions.


I woke up from my dream and had this sitting in my garage! TapTurn with strobe effects added.

Have a look at this experiement on my Liberty....

Not sure if signals like this are legal? A quick double blink for Tapturn and regular signaling.


Here is wag-wag in strobe effect, these blink two times per side.


And a slow motion wigwag (aka the easter egg mode) rendered in strobes, these blink 4 times per side.
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