Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby west_minist » Mon Nov 04, 2013 6:00 am

Mike,

My dad thought me do it right the first time. Otherwise you dont have to come back. You keep going forward :)

I hope your logging come out close. Remember what I highlighted.

You all have a great Sunday!
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby Tradewind » Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:10 am

True enough -

There is only small step to get to that 300whp - definitely doable if you can get the tune/ECU to play ball
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby CarDoc » Thu Nov 14, 2013 11:17 am

I received my Tactrix yesterday. Got a 6' extension cable with it so maybe I'll stop cracking the Open Port connection with my shoulder. I now have 3 with one new one, 1 with Mike getting a repair and the 3rd will be on its way to Mike for repair Saturday. Plenty of backups now.

I also have a JDM turbo hood on the way. Its white and will have the honeycomb grille with white trim. I'll get it painted to match when the weather warms up. I'm going to swap the hoods so I can get accurate measurements for my air system.

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BadAss :29:

I'll get pics on the car when I have it mounted.
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby Tradewind » Thu Nov 14, 2013 6:18 pm

Ha, this just had to come, America's most extreme 3.0 Gen 3 gets ALL the goodies, going to look insane
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby vicious_fishes » Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:12 pm

hey guys, what's going on in this thread?

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:P
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby CarDoc » Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:37 pm

Tradewind wrote:Ha, this just had to come, America's most extreme 3.0 Gen 3 gets ALL the goodies, going to look insane


And I just got notification that its being dropped off tomorrow. 3 days from Japan. :D
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby Tradewind » Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:58 pm

VF

Thanks for joining up and appropriately on this thread of extremely rare information - the supercharging of the single port engine.

If when you run into the unique situations that only this engine and its ECU can provide I believe CARDOC can point you in the right direction, ie injector sealing etc.

Give us a run down of your goals with the 3.0 Impreza, powerwise etc and maybe Cardoc can save you some $$ and time since he works this topic over most days of his life at the moment - and with very good outcomes
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby vicious_fishes » Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:30 pm

just read the entire thread. let me see if i can summarise:

the injectors are some weird long things which have collar-seals. OP fabbed up some madness with pvc pipe, but apparently longer injectors DO exist on the market? was pvc pipe the only way to do it or could something else be done? e.g go ghetto as and theoretically, run a lap/collar of silicone around them once they're installed? i still couldn't work out how the OP got the short injectors to play nice? could you just lower the fuel rails by 8mm?

MAP sensor needs to be changed for boost, i take it to one that can read higher?

couldn't quite understand why the ECU couldn't be reflashed initially?
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby CarDoc » Mon Nov 18, 2013 12:19 am

vicious_fishes wrote:just read the entire thread. let me see if i can summarise:

the injectors are some weird long things which have collar-seals. OP fabbed up some madness with pvc pipe, but apparently longer injectors DO exist on the market? was pvc pipe the only way to do it or could something else be done? e.g go ghetto as and theoretically, run a lap/collar of silicone around them once they're installed? i still couldn't work out how the OP got the short injectors to play nice? could you just lower the fuel rails by 8mm?

MAP sensor needs to be changed for boost, i take it to one that can read higher?

couldn't quite understand why the ECU couldn't be reflashed initially?


The OEM injectors used on this engine are not only longer, but have a the lip at the base to seal the air ports on the head. No one makes an injector for this engine that is larger than 285cc. No one rebuilds or resizes the OEM type injectors for high volume fuel delivery. So, in order to maintain usage of the factory plugs, I used WRX 410cc injectors the first year. I've recently updated to 650ccc injectors to give it more fuel. Also, no one makes a 3 injector rail, go figure, so I had to make a rail that would work. I cut the legs, rewelded the legs in the position that allowed for proper fit, trimmed the pvc pipe to make up for the missing seal lip and added shims to make sure the seals at the base of the injector sealed tight against the head. Without the seals at the base of the injector or a tight seal, vacuum leak. Actually, I would install the injectors, smoke the intake, make adjustments, smoke it again, more adjustments in repetition until I got it sized and sealed.

Its running the WRX 3 BAR now and is working, but the scaling for the MAP is off or the computers are confused, I've used two ECM with identical results. We've figured out that somewhere in the ECM RAM there is another scaler for the MAP and the ROM scaler is conflicting with it. The data reported is backward concerning absolute and relative. It shows 8 & -6 instead of 6 & -8. Its running and calculating fuel according to the MAP voltage, but the reported data is wrong. When the computer sees 7 psi boost, its actually 9-9.5.

The ECM can be reflashed all day long prior. The issue was retuning the ROM outside the parameters of Subaru engineering. Meaning, no tuner would touch it because there were NO DEFINITIONS available to tune the car. Until Ed (XRT) took it on. And we didn't think of a 3 BAR sensor and rescaling because we didn't have the definitions to manipulate it until Ed (FPT) got help from a couple Rom Raider forum members.

The proper definitions are still being worked on. dshultz with RR is breaking down the RAM. Working with the programming on this car is like working with WRX/STI programming when first started. Its new territory, but this system is baffling the hackers with the missing links and the 3D fuel map that constantly switches how it manages the fuel. Its not just based on the MAP voltages, other factors are interfering.

More information on the complete build is here: Sleeper VDC
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby vicious_fishes » Wed Nov 20, 2013 1:24 am

oh well see now that's a different forum...


in all seriousness OP, ignoring the rails what would be stopping me from getting some regular injectors, putting some washers over them, mounting them in the head and going postal with a tube of silicone? ghetto as i know, but i don't see what would stop it from working?
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby vicious_fishes » Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:21 am

found some that are long enough OP, but without the big fat collars:

http://www.nzefi.com/product/siemens-66 ... -injector/

however nissan RB series injectors appear to fatten out like necessary: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nissan-RB26DETT ... 1149535274 but no idea about the length.
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby CarDoc » Wed Nov 20, 2013 6:47 am

vicious_fishes wrote:found some that are long enough OP, but without the big fat collars:

http://www.nzefi.com/product/siemens-66 ... -injector/

however nissan RB series injectors appear to fatten out like necessary: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nissan-RB26DETT ... 1149535274 but no idea about the length.


I went through this last year. Bosch makes an injector that fits Honda, but like the Nissan sensors you posted, too short. Their shorter than the WRX.

If you can find someone that can resize the OEM, maybe. Going with the WRX injectors is the best route.
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby vicious_fishes » Wed Nov 20, 2013 6:58 am

yeah i just discovered that early S2000 injectors have the collar and are same as standard wrx injectors (regular top feeds) in terms of length.

i've got a friend with an EZ30R so i'm going to see if his fuel rail would work with our EZ30D block/S2000 injectors, seeing as that rail is for standard top feeds.
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby CarDoc » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:51 am

Got the hood on today. Its WHITE. Stands out for sure. Have a gap under the grille as expected and its a tad close to the headlight. I'll take care of that later on. My experiment will continue, then the body will be straightened out. :29:

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Here's some at the apartment and the camera lens isn't all foggy with grease. (no the lens is fine, thanks to OtterBox)

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I also made the diagnostic and programming connectors switchable. No more crawling under the dash. No more broken Openport. No more plug issues. Suckers are on a switch by the steering wheel where they can't get hit accidentally. Get in the car, hook the cables up, which I now have laid out in a semi-permanent fashion under the carpeting and around the seat and the Openport is now connected to a 6' extension cable and is out of the way of getting hit by anything, flip the switches and run the software.

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Progress.
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Re: Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

Postby vicious_fishes » Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:18 am

checked out my mates EZ30R vs our EZ30D today OP, and it would appear that the fuel rails can be swapped over from the R to the D if you just flip them over 180 degrees. obviously you need to run custom inlet lines then but it makes the short(er) but collared honda injectors workable. all my measurements lined up so now all i need to do is go buy a pair and test fit. fingers crossed!
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