Outback 3.0 w/ single port heads - SUPERCHARGED

[Tradewind]

I might add for the Australian and metric readers



That's 213kw at the wheels from that early generation H6 engine.

[west_minist]

Here you go. Sorry. Its 6:32am here and working on the 2008 WRX VP Rallymax Tune.
http://www.xtremeracingtuning.com/forum ... f=40&t=468

Rev 8 wkw.png (26.19 KiB) Viewed 4478 times

[CarDoc]

Today on the rollers, tried to push 300 by tuning the timing. Every time the timing was bumped up, the ECM would take it back in knock retard. Two theories: Knock sensors are picking up SC noise or the plugs need to go hotter. We did figure out that the car likes lean, so we tried to keep it around 13.

The numbers here are on different ROM revisions. The 291.75 did not knock bad, -3 at about 6000 rpm up.

[west_minist]

Time to look at exhaust and intake flow.

[CarDoc]

Time to look at exhaust and intake flow.

I still don't know what I can possibly do with the exhaust except go larger pipe.

The intake: need to get the manifold runner locked shut or retro a plastic intake from a Gen 3 3.0R

[CarDoc]

I posted this on the other forum where the build thread is ( Sleeper VDC )

This car has come a long way. From its beginnings in Boston to the heat of Central Texas, its traveled a lot of miles. It flipped 191k this week while I was running 100 mph. People can't believe how old it is. People wouldn't believe this was possible. "Professional" builders and tuners only saw instant failure. "You'll blow the motor", "The computer won't run it", "You'll fail".

And?

I wasn't concerned for the engine. The EZ30 is a tough son of a bitch. Its an aircraft engine put on 4 wheels and a cage wrapped around it. I knew the engine could take it. My concern was the management. Sure, I could have put the engine in anything else. I could have done the norm and just modified an STI. Where's the fun in that? Instead I have a top of the line Subaru Outback VDC with all the systems working that puts out, at the date of this post, 286 WHP. Go anywhere and get there faster. That's what some of us want. That's what some of us get. As long as we don't listen to the negative hype and bullshit spewed from the mouths of internet junkies that believe everything they read without actually researching what they've read.

So far, the ones who worked on my ECM are spread out in different countries, all communicating via e-mail, texting, WhatsApp, etc.. Each have varying levels of expertise and experience. A couple of them haven't even communicated with the others at all, but had access to the work at hand. What started out as an impossible venture has become a great accomplishment to these people. Each one has a piece of this car in them. They stepped outside the box they were in and extended their efforts to make it work. Everyone learned something from this. A lot of beliefs changed.

Tim at Raptor had first responded to me that he didn't think it would work with this car. After looking at several builders of turbos and superchargers, I kept at him. Because he makes a great product and he's always working to improve on it, I wanted to know who he knew could possibly help out.

Tuners were contacted all over the world. No one wanted to touch it. They believed the ECM was not capable of running the engine. Months of emails to people who purported knowledge and skill in Subaru, Nissan and Mitsubishi ECM tuning and engine building would either have a negative response or none at all. "Delete - Trash". Don't need you.

Here comes Ed from XRT. He believes he can make it work and is willing to try. Off we go. 3 reflashes that worked and my car is in the works for good. Ed worked long hours on this ROM and treated it as if it was his own car. I liked that. I treat every customer's car I touch as its my own and I expect it from others. Its a quality that's hard to find but it shows where the heart is. Weeks go by, issues pop up, Ed is still there, patient, Tim is biting his nails and I keep telling them, it'll work. Maxed out the tune as far as possible and left the car leaning out above 5500 rpm until someone figured out what to do about the MAP sensor issue.

10 months later, here's another Ed from Fast Performance Tuning (I still chuckle. If these two Eds ever get together in the same room, you may think they're twins. Not by looks, but in the way they work and take responsibility for what they do. I'd bet once they start talking to each other, the conversation may not end.) Ed has an idea that no one thought about up to his entry in this chore. Change the MAP sensor. Duh. Why the hell didn't we think of it prior? Because all the cars have always been tuned with OEM equipment. But this is speed density and the voltage is the key. Rescaling the OEM sensor was out of the question, so from Ed #2, change the sensor, problem solved. Well, close. I still think the ECM is criss crossing absolute and relative pressures and the values are off (I have another ECM on standby). But, its enough to "Tune this thing", as Ed puts it. He put a lot of hours into this ECM also.

We all got input from different people this last year concerning its programming. It would seem its been a worldwide venture. US, Australia, Nederlands, Barbados, S. Africa, Canada and different engineers in varying countries in Europe.

It seems this car wants to make people work. Don't come at it with preconceived notions that it can be tamed easily or you'll just trick it. No. It toys with you. Makes you think you're in control of it, then BAM, "Who's your daddy?". Not that way, try again. Headaches, cuts, bruises, high blood pressure, late nights with pencil and paper, research, math, math and more math. So many equations working at once. And its not just the engine. I'm still working towards drivetrain components that will hold the engine and trans in the car. It wants to jump out and go. (Look closely at the video, you'll see. When the car lifts, the engine keeps lifting. It needs the car to keep up. Its like the dog that pulls on the leash. Come one!!! Lets go!!)

But it still drives normal. Smooth. I don't take it at high speeds all the time. Its a cruiser. Its comfortable and sounds great. It has an excellent stereo system and the AC is perfect. The ride is perfect. And when the itch comes to take it to the limit, its ready. When I'm driving down the expressway and that kid in the Mustang 5.0 slows for a double take and taunts, all I do is floor it and watch it in the mirror as I leave it behind. You know what I'm talking about, but its not just that a wagon just outran a plastic Ford. Its the instant rumble, the push back in the seat, the feel of the car accelerating and the small rise in blood pressure that gives you what you want. Its the heartbeat of the engine racing with yours.

That's why you build it. That's why you work at it. That's why you drive it. Its you and you become a part of it.

I can't thank these guys enough, really. Ed, Ed, Tim, guys from the RR forum I haven't met, the few tuners that stepped in to help where they could from outside the immediate circle and locals that kept cheering me on.

Thank You

We'll see if we can push it further. I still have a delivery from Tim I'm waiting on. Not sure exactly what its going to accomplish, but he says I'll like it. Its only a couple weeks behind. (hint, hint Tim )

[west_minist]

Thank you. Here is your latest Dynoes from your logs.

rev 12L 2nd Gear Dyno SAE Dynoes.png (27.36 KiB) Viewed 4441 times

[west_minist]

Mike,

I am not sure what the VE of the engine is, but if it is around the same as the dual port heads, your power is right.

Your cams/ve will start to fall off pretty heavy around 7000. So looking at the possible VE below:

Code: Select all

      VE                        
3000   3500   4000   4500   5000   5500   6000   6500   7000   7500   8000
1.00   1.02   1.02   1.05   1.06   1.10   1.10   1.00   0.95   0.90   0.85


The engine flow will be the following BASED on boost curve:

Code: Select all

3000   3500   4000   4500   5000   5500   6000   6500   7000   7500   8000
16   19   21   25   28   32   35   34   35   36   36


Code: Select all

CHP   WHP (est)   A/f   BFSC   Wa (lb/min)   wkw
560   510   10.9   0.55   56   380
540   490   10.9   0.55   54   365
540   490   10.9   0.55   54   365
520   470   10.9   0.55   52   350
500   450   10.9   0.55   50   336
480   430   10.9   0.55   48   321
460   410   10.9   0.55   46   306
440   390   10.9   0.55   44   291
420   370   10.9   0.55   42   276
400   350   10.9   0.55   40   261
380   330   10.9   0.55   38   246
360   310   10.9   0.55   36   231
340   290   10.9   0.55   34   216
320   270   10.9   0.55   32   201
300   250   10.9   0.55   30   186
260   210   10.9   0.55   26   157


[CarDoc]

That would be 10 psi at 6500 with 10.9 afr figured with .9 efficiency to reach 310.

Not enough fuel in the maps. Its running over 12 in all the logs. But if the relative pressure is off by 2 psi like I think it is, then the ECM is calculating for 6 psi when its actually about 8 which would cause the leaner A/F values.

Need to add fuel to get it closer to 10:1. Maybe it will balance out. Maybe I'll put the other ECM in and reflash it and see what it gives me for absolute/relative and compare the two.

[CarDoc]

Put in the other ECM, again, but this time I found the error and fixed it and was able to reflash it with the ROM I was running on the original ECM. The absolute and relative pressures look to be normal. The off throttle response is better. Acceleration from cruise is better. It seems to kick a little more.

I'll find out after driving it more and see where the RAM data gets us. Can't flash without a new Open Port anyway.

Oh yeah, more deconstruction of the computer going on.

[Tradewind]

HA

The best never rest!

[CarDoc]

That MAP relative/absolute has been bugging me. Sure the tune gained power, but the math is wrong because the values were wrong and I believe this to be the issue still with the "knocking" at high rpm. I think dshultz, (Rom Raider) is going to figure out how to map the dual banks along with making it possible to see a learning view from this ECM.

Progress is good.

[CarDoc]

Doing math for 6 hours can suck.

Between the two "peak" ROMs, 12B from Ed and 12F Jon altered on the dyno, the fuel is too lean in both. It doesn't come in early enough and by the time the engine is ramped up, it stays lean. Also the VE table is wrong. In 12F, the knock starts at about 4500, the fuel is too lean and MAP V is at 2.6. Target fuel should be 11.1 and remain starting at 2.3V/3500 rpm.

Add fuel at 2.5V where it starts to drop, increase the VE above 4k and it should increase HP. The timing should be good where it is in both ROMs (which happen to have the same timing). I'll reflash it with what I've changed and see what happens. Its probably going to be next week.

I'm not worried about the reported MAP sensor values in RR right now. If dshultz finds the parameters we need on his end, then maybe it can be corrected. If nothing else, at least we may get a Learning View out of it.

Onward and upward.

[Tradewind]

Do you ever give up?? Tenacity +

Really quite mind blowing

[CarDoc]

My dad always said, "Don't do anything half-assed, do it right or not at all."