Lets talk tuning (KiDo Tunes)

[<GB>]

D.You claimed my AVCS tables were to blame for the AVCS cam gears being off... yet you know it is not the case I retuned another 07 on the weekend from your current tuner, it had the AVCS issue as well .

avcs issues still may be the tune, not all tuners think like yourself and coyote.A few tuners think its the tuning of the avcs! whos right then?

Well... it is only limited to the 07/08 cars and only affects the manuals, which makes you wonder could it be something else?

Constant SINE wave signal in the logs showed up my suspicion, was too regular for it to be oil control as engine oil pressure is a variable at different rpm. BBB got me logs and I saw the sine wave pulse, logged EVERYTHING on a stock 07 and saw the cause. Simple fix, which should cost under $8 will be posted shortly

What about the mechanical gear that's failing and people are replacing and its fixing the issues?

[bigBADbenny]

Could be 2 issues: lag & oscillation

I guess we'll see soon...

[KiDo_Tuning]

avcs issues still may be the tune, not all tuners think like yourself and coyote.A few tuners think its the tuning of the avcs! whos right then?

Well... it is only limited to the 07/08 cars and only affects the manuals, which makes you wonder could it be something else?

Constant SINE wave signal in the logs showed up my suspicion, was too regular for it to be oil control as engine oil pressure is a variable at different rpm. BBB got me logs and I saw the sine wave pulse, logged EVERYTHING on a stock 07 and saw the cause. Simple fix, which should cost under $8 will be posted shortly

What about the mechanical gear that's failing and people are replacing and its fixing the issues?

Plenty of UK and JDM cars have replaced cam gears and had no improvement All 07's as well...
First one I logged with the issue was last September on an untuned MY07 FXT

Since engine oil pressure varies, if it was a cam gear you would see the sine wave pulse width vary as oil pressure changes as higher oil pressure would cause more 'slip' or atleast have higher variance in the OCV duty.

[<GB>]

So you're saying all the cars u have seen that have this issue haven't been fixed by the gear or solenoid? Are the jdm and euro cars ones u have tuned? I have researched a bit and never found much on the topic?

[KiDo_Tuning]

So you're saying all the cars u have seen that have this issue haven't been fixed by the gear or solenoid? Are the jdm and euro cars ones u have tuned? I have researched a bit and never found much on the topic?

I know a few tuners internationally but some of the cars I have tuned(around 110 in Japan in the last few years and 60+ in the UK/Europe) have been checking it out as well, plus my guys have even checked their friends workshop tuned cars to see how wide spread it is... which is where the 07 only thing has come about

Some have been fixed by a solenoid, only seen the gear once. Since Bruce was pointed at replacing the gear first, you would assume MSR must have seen it before(which makes it a common issue if that was the instant diagnosis)

However, those 10 or so that have replaced the gear and/or solenoid have had the issue come back which is where finding the cause, not fixing the symptoms became something worthwhile investigating.

Is it not odd that the 07 Spec C STi has 45 degrees AVCS stock at high load, yet does not have issues? It has a different wiring loom

[bigBADbenny]

I had a vague feeling I was tempting fate buying a somewhat complex used performance vehicle

Thank goodness the fixes are ahhh... relatively inexpensive

Every time I mitigate another issue it's like driving a new car ftw

[Kekotic]

I had a vague feeling I was tempting fate buying a somewhat complex used performance vehicle

Thank goodness the fixes are ahhh... relatively inexpensive

Every time I mitigate another issue it's like driving a new car ftw

How is buying new cam gears inexpensive?

[<GB>]

Were the 10 or so on forums? Cam we get links to any of these cars? We're all these cars tuned? Or stock?

[<GB>]

I had a vague feeling I was tempting fate buying a somewhat complex used performance vehicle

Thank goodness the fixes are ahhh... relatively inexpensive

Every time I mitigate another issue it's like driving a new car ftw

How is buying new cam gears inexpensive?

Sounds like he's going to do this diode first

[bigBADbenny]

I had a vague feeling I was tempting fate buying a somewhat complex used performance vehicle

Thank goodness the fixes are ahhh... relatively inexpensive

Every time I mitigate another issue it's like driving a new car ftw

How is buying new cam gears inexpensive?

Well a ahh compared to $400 odd for glamour "adjustable" exhaust cam gears yeah.
And bugger all to have them installed with the new timing belt.
Which you'll have to do sooner or later.

Inexpensive compared to eg a 30" sailboat for sure!
More fun too maybe

[Kekotic]

I had a vague feeling I was tempting fate buying a somewhat complex used performance vehicle

Thank goodness the fixes are ahhh... relatively inexpensive

Every time I mitigate another issue it's like driving a new car ftw

How is buying new cam gears inexpensive?

Well a ahh compared to $400 odd for glamour "adjustable" exhaust cam gears yeah.
And bugger all to have them installed with the new timing belt.
Which you'll have to do sooner or later.

Inexpensive compared to eg a 30" sailboat for sure!
More fun too maybe

Sorry what do you mean?
If the problem is a *diode* or whatever like Matt is saying (not saying that is the case but just saying...if it IS the case)
Why would you also need to eventually change the cam gears "sooner or later"?

Speak english doc

Edit: I think I have just realised you are somehow talking about JacksGTB build....but I do not know why.

[<GB>]

Ben are you replacing the exhaust cam gear? U got duel avcs....

[dr20t]

Ben are you replacing the exhaust cam gear? U got duel avcs....

Dual aer maybe

Dual avcs - absolutely not

I see what Matt's point is on this. If the problems causing this cam gear damage are not cam gear related in and of themselves, then you're only masking the problem potentially.

It's like changing a spark plug that's fouled due to rich mixtures and then scratching your head when the new plug fouls 1000kms later. Using the same analogy you would fix the rich mixture here at the same time as changin the fouled plug not just the plug and hope for the problem to fix itself

That's if we are certain it's not the oem cam gears themselves that are the problem (build quality, assembly or otherwise)

Mick

[alexeiwoody]

Sorry what do you mean?
If the problem is a *diode* or whatever like Matt is saying (not saying that is the case but just saying...if it IS the case)
Why would you also need to eventually change the cam gears "sooner or later"?

Speak english doc

Edit: I think I have just realised you are somehow talking about JacksGTB build....but I do not know why.

I think bbb meant you have to do the timing belt sooner or later anyway, so doesn't hurt to do the cam gears as the belts getting done anyway.

If matt is right, then you boys might have to keep replacing the inlet gears over and over....

Anyone know why this is not an issue on autos?

Edit: if it's really the wiring loom, considering how diodes are a one way door and matt says there's a sine wave...that's a pretty big stuff up on subarus behalf. To not put diodes into the right place is a fatal mistake. Which makes this a pretty far fetched theory. Anyone else seeing the sine wave?

[KiDo_Tuning]

I think bbb meant you have to do the timing belt sooner or later anyway, so doesn't hurt to do the cam gears as the belts getting done anyway.

If matt is right, then you boys might have to keep replacing the inlet gears over and over....

Anyone know why this is not an issue on autos?

Edit: if it's really the wiring loom, considering how diodes are a one way door and matt says there's a sine wave...that's a pretty big stuff up on subarus behalf. To not put diodes into the right place is a fatal mistake. Which makes this a pretty far fetched theory. Anyone else seeing the sine wave?

Subaru did not forget to put diodes in... they just did not shield the wiring correctly. Oddly enough, 09 LGT's do not have the issue as the wiring loom is shielded on the drivers side of the car
Auto wiring loom is different to the manuals as well

AVCS_Sine.png (24.16 KiB) Viewed 3496 times

Looks pretty consistent to me, as long as AVCS is active, it has the same signal pulsewidth. Sings more consistently than Justin Beiber!