ER HC, DTC C0116, Battery Light, No Start

[boydbino]

Recently swapped an Ez30 in and out of my 2005 Gen4 Spec.b.

When I swapped it, there was a tune loaded up to the ECU when the engine was disconnected to the interior bulkhead from the two main connector plugs.

New engine went back in and I went to crank and I had the following issues:

[list=]ER HC displayed on ODO
Battery Light On
CEL On
DTC (C0116 Brake Switch Fault) when doing the cheat code for DTC on the ODO
Temp is pegged to hot
Starter motor does not work / click
Cannot connect to OBD2 / ECU however I get power through this port[/list]

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What works?

Fuel Pump Primes
Fuel Gauge Works

I have done some basic diagnostics but I think I need to try these again as I am not 100% confident with the multi meter.

I have viewed some FSM diagnostics procedures and a lot of it requires the SSM software.

Any help would be greatly appreciated

[bigBADbenny]

Cheers Hamish, can you be specific about the order of the swap process including what harnesses were used where before you reverted to your original harnesses on the new engine.

Here’s a basic guide to the various harneses (lhd disgrams) so you can use the correct nomenclature.
https://iwireusa.com/blogs/iwire-univer ... -explained

Full disclosure on the harness info is useful because there are different harneses available and without testing or using the specific FSM’s info we can’t know if an incorrect harness has damaged the ecu, bcm etc.
That includes the year of the replacement engine, from where it was sourced, even though you’ve swapped all sensors from your old engine.

Posting your vin might be helpful too, eg for the exact build date as it’s relevant to your canbus setup etc.

[bigBADbenny]

Let's look at your DTC C0116:
From the MY05 FSM C0116
I'm using a General Market Legacy 2005 FSM https://www.dropbox.com/s/ilvndv4b9s29l ... l.pdf?dl=0

Stop light switch signal circuit malfunction Brake Light Switch
<Ref. to ABS(diag)-61, DTC C0116 FAULTY STOP LIGHT SWITCH, Diagnostic Procedure with Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC).>

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So step one & two you can't connect via SSM yet, eg RomRaider (suspect install on Windows10?) try FreeSSM on PC or BtSSM on Android?
Here's a link to a version of FreeSSM I'm using, you might need to use eg XP compatibility mode in Win10: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ptiz5o6w ... r98xo&dl=0

However we do know eg Torque via ELM327 does not connect: but there's caveats: review the Torque App connection method info faq online if you haven't previously used Torque, we discussed this recently on the forum so a search might provide the link.
Here: https://www.totalcardiagnostics.com/sup ... leshooting
Via here: viewtopic.php?f=45&t=37377

But you do see the brake light coming on at least at step 3.

Step 4, is a test for discontinuity aka an open circuit between the ABS Control Module/Hydraulic Unit and chassis ground with the brake pedal depressed: (B301) No. 20 (+) — Chassis ground (−):

There's a few ways to test this and many considerations. Most basic is a continuity mode test, the symbol on the dial being a black triangle with a line on the right hands side: the multimeter (MM) will beep or show zero on the display. If you're unsure just run the test on the meter with probes touched together.

But the FSM calls for a voltage test, so put the MM into DC Volts mode, the V with a solid line and a broken line below it.
With the red probe in the VohmsmA socket on the MM and the black probe in the COM negative socket, red probe to pin 20 + and black probe to any clean chassis ground, what Volts do you read on the MM, and how do they compare to battery Volts?

So at this point I go to the open FSM pdf, start searching the wiring diagrams section, eg click that chapter at the lhs, and search eg B301, cycle through the hits till you get to Bulkhead Wiring Harness (In Engine Compartment) and find that plug in the map or legend/index of the harness plug map.

We want pin 20 in the B301 connector plug. Any wiring diagram page that has B301 will have the pinout map for the connector at the lower margin.

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Depending on the outcome of that test: is there poor contact in connector between stop light switch and ABSCM&H/U?

Then the next step is to check the ABS control module isn't damaged or potentially check a previously used Bulkhead Wiring Harness (In Engine Compartment) had the correct pin assignments to the original harness,

[boydbino]

Thanks Ben

Some Information

P/N for my engine / model / make

• VIN: JF1BPEKN36G033487
• ENGINE HARNESS P/N BASED ON MY VIN: 24020AD430 (KA)
• SECONDARY MANIFOLD HARNESS: 24020AD420 (KA)

Parts used when swapped

• ENGINE HARNESS P/N BASED ON MY VIN: 24020AD430 (KA)
• SECONDARY MANIFOLD HARNESS: 24020AD420 (KA)
• EZ30 ENGINE DBL2G-32 199154 (Likely Tribecca)
  
• ALL ENGINE RELATED SENSORS NOT FROM THE ORIGINAL ENGINE
• Original Engine Fuel Rails / Fuel Hard Lines and Intake Manifold

TIMELINE:

• 1: INTAKE MANIFOLD WAS REMOVED / FUEL RAILS WERE DISCONNECTED FROM MANIFOLD (LAST TIME ENGINE WAS RUN WAS BEFORE THIS)
• 2: ENGINE TURBO AND TURBO MANIFOLDS WERE REMOVED
• 3: ENGINE ACCESSORIES WERE REMOVED / PREPARED FOR REMOVAL
• 4: ECU WAS FLASHED WITH RUNNING IN TUNE (ALSO WAS UNLOCKED) CAR WAS DISCONNECTED FROM BATTERY AND +,- TERMINALS WERE CONNECTED WITH JUMPER CABLES
  
  NOTE * ER HC APPEARED AT THIS STAGE WHEN THE CAR NEEDED TO BE POWERED TO UNLOCK THE STEERING COLUMN, HOWEVER ASSUME THIS WAS DUE TO THE GREEN CONNECTORS BEING LEFT CONNECTED*
  
• 5: ENGINE WAS REMOVED FROM CAR, ALL HARNESSES DISCONNECTED ((LOTS OF SHAKING, PUSHING ETC TO REMOVE ENGINE))
• 6: SUBFRAME WAS CLEANED UP AND STEERING RACK WAS REPLACED
• 7: CLUTCH WAS ATTACHED TO ENGINE / ALIGNED AND ENGINE WAS PUT INTO THE CAR (DIFFICULTY MATING ENGINE TO GEARBOX CLUTCH COVER WAS BENT AND FOULING ON BOX)
• 8: ENGINE WAS CONNECTED UP AND PLUGGED IN, WIRING HARNESS (NEW WIRING HARNESS 24020AD430, 24020AD420 WAS USED)
• 9: TURBO WAS CONNECTED BACK TO THE ENGINE / EXHAUST SYSTEM
• 10: ALL OTHER ACCESSORIES WERE CONNECTED / FILLED WITH OIL (RADIATOR DISCONNECTED)
• 11: ATTEMPTED START WITH FUEL PUMP FUSE DISCONNECTED TO GET OIL PRESSURE
• 12: NO START, ER HC, FUEL TEMP TO FULL HOT, FUEL PUMP PRIMES AND FUEL GAUGE WORKS
• 13: ENGINE LOOM, (24020AD430, 24020AD420), SWAPPED BACK TO ORIGINAL LOOM FROM ORIGINAL ENGINE
• 14: NO START, ER HC, FUEL TEMP TO FULL HOT, FUEL PUMP PRIMES AND FUEL GAUGE WORKS
• 15: COOLANT TEMP SENSOR SWAPPED FROM OLD ENGINE TO ORIGINAL ENGINE
• 16: NO START, ER HC, FUEL TEMP TO FULL HOT, FUEL PUMP PRIMES AND FUEL GAUGE WORKS
• 17: COOLANT TEMP SENSOR SWAPPED FROM OLD ENGINE TO ORIGINAL ENGINE
• 18: NO START, ER HC, FUEL TEMP TO FULL HOT, FUEL PUMP PRIMES AND FUEL GAUGE WORKS
• 19: CHEAT CODE FOR DTC DISPLAYED ON DASH (C0116 BRAKE SWITCH FAILURE)

FAILURE TO CONNECT ELM327 BLUETOOTH DEVICE
FAILURE TO CONNECT GENERING OBD2 SCAN TOOL
TACTRIX DIFFICULTY TO CONNECT (LIKELY WINDOWS / COMPUTER ISSUES)

BATTERY:
BATTERY WORLD TESTED 650CCA
13.8V FULLY CHARGED
24 HOUR VOLTAGE DROP TEST TBC

DIAGNOSTICS SO FAR:

• 1: ENGINE GROUNDS CHECKED (STARTER MOTOR, BELLHOUSING LOCATION, COOLANT TEMP SENSOR PLUG, CHASSIS GROUNDS
• 2: RESISTANCE OF FUSES CHECKED (0.03 Ohm)
• 3: C0116 DIAGNOSTIC TROUBLESHOOT BRAKE LIGHT SWITCH ILLUMINATES THE LIGHT (MAY NEED TO TROUBLESHOOT AGAIN)

[bigBADbenny]

That's great, I'll review the info carefully...
I've gone into the C0116 diagnostics: step 4 is the key: looking forward to you confirming step 4 as a known good or bad so we can move on.
Do assume I'm going to add edits to any posts as I get time to add more info. I'm still editing the C0116 reply.
More edits added...

[boydbino]

In regards to differences between wiring and parts numbers across the models

Engine (suspected tribecca)
Harness P/N 24020AD430, 24020AD420 (VIN: 4S4WXEKU57S006953)

Engine (Automatic 2005 3.0 Spec.b)
Harness P/N 24020AD430, 24020AD420 (VIN: JF1BPEKU56G033930)

Things to note, it seems that Tribecca's and maybe other automatic EZ30 have the engine ground bolted in the two locations vs the 1 location on my car. You can view this below:

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[bigBADbenny]

At the beginning of the diag, your battery volts were low at 12.1V.
12.4V is regarded as the minimum healthy voltage level to start the car, this is a universal rule of thumb consideration.

So since you can't start or obdii connect, I'd recommend using a maintenance charger on the battery when its in the car, between diagnostic sessions.
That way you'll know you're starting with a known good fundamental, and are not damaging the now hopefully known good battery.

Because your battery volts did go low whilst the swap was under way, and once the no crank, no start, no obdii comms issue is resolved, you might consider looking for parasitic drain in the electrical system, in the meantime use a maintenance charger between diagnostic sessions, eg remove that when working on the car.

How are you going with step 4 in the C0116 diagnostics?

The process is clear:
First put your MM into DC Volts mode (V symbol with a solid line and a broken line below it).

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With the red probe in the VohmsmA socket on the MM and the black probe in the COM negative socket

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Then pull the large plug from the ABS module/pump assy, locate pin 20 in the plug, use the red MM probe at pin 20, black probe at any clean chassis ground:

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You can see the orientation of the plug because its asymmetric, just count the pins back eg from the right hand side to find pin 20, alternatively the FSM diagrams might have the wire insulation colour.
What voltage do you see on the multimeter, with your assistant depressing the brake pedal?

[boydbino]

UPDATE:

Battery voltage drop test:
13.8v fully charged
13v after 48 hours

After plugged in for 20 minutes, dropped to 12.5v

C0116 Step 4 completed:
Displayed 12.4v when brake pedal depressed (Battery displayed 12.5v)

Voltage test on all grounds:
Starter Motor Ground 0.03V
Engine Bulkhead to Engine Ground: 0.06V
RH Engine to Chassis Ground: 0.00V
LH Engine to Chassis Ground: 0.00V
ABS Module Harness to Chassis Ground: 0.00V

Next step maybe would be:
COMMUNICATION FOR INITIALIZING IMPOSSIBLE
Under LAN SYSTEM DIAGNOSTICS

[bigBADbenny]

That’s great, some known goods to tick off.
By all means did into the lan diagnostics, or better yet…

Go to step 5 in C0116, is there poor contact in the plug between the Abscm/HU plug and stop light switch? B159?

I’ll find that plug in the wiring diagrams, stat.

I noticed I'm not using a general market FSM yet, btw so this diagram is LHD.

B159 Pole 9 Colour Brown Area C-2 Connects to Fuse & relay box (F/B)

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FB-3 Stop light and brake switch, B159 etc:


WI-146:

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Note Each unit is either directly grounded to the body
or indirectly grounds through a harness ground terminal

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[bigBADbenny]

So we know the ABSCM/HU plug is getting voltage at pin20, but step 5 still recommends checking the integrity/continuity between the stop light switch B65 and B301.
In between those is B159 and R168, the letters corresponding to bulkhead harness and front harness.

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[bigBADbenny]

I wanted to use a general market FSM specifically for MY05 so I went to my FSM faq (red link in my signature), went to the repository at sli dot net, scrolled down to the AUDM section:
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/showthread.php?1 ... nuals-(FSM
Downloaded it from the mediafire website:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/yri3i ... 005_(BP-BL).zip

[bigBADbenny]

Thinking around your issue: no crank, no start, no obdii comms, engine swap, C0116 mostly confirmed good (volts & continuity at least)… What’s the next step?

We know that in diagnostic mode, green plugs connected, there’s no cycling of solenoids and electric eg fan motors…

Hitting up the iWire site for info, it’s the ecu that controls those systems, not eg the “other” ecu, the BCM (aka body unit integrated in the fsm)…
https://iwireusa.com/blogs/iwire-univer ... -test-mode

However with diagnostic mode enabled, do you see the related codes on the odometer, which would indicate that the ecu is alive and well?

So our focus might be to test the ecu and it’s power supply circuit (includes the main relay behind and above right of the glovebox), again on the iWire site, if the ecu has no power, and it’s fuse checks out ok, the cause of no power can be the main relay.
https://iwireusa.com/blogs/iwire-univer ... -connector

Then there’s testing the ecu and ultimately the engine and related grounds.

All of this is to rule out connections missed during the swap.

If everything checks out, your next best option might be to bench re-flash the ecu, or temporarily try a known good ecu to see if the car will crank before the lack of security handshake prevents starting. Prior to the latter blind test, I’d inspect your current ecu for burnt components on both sides of the board, just in case something major happened to it.

Let’s start with my favourite guru: the trainer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-dErsbRWtU

Ok that vid assumes there’s still obdii comms, so here’s another for no comms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3aoD5B ... VjdSB0ZXN0
Yep that’s the one, be aware the host absolutely rips through the tests and considerations, so maybe just go through the steps one by one, and look for the equivalent tests in the fsm.
This vid does cover testing the high speed canbus, but with an oscilloscope.
For testing high speed canbus with a basic multimeter, see this test, it’s relevant because one of the tests can be done at the abscm/HU plug, the fsm will state if that’s the location of the terminating resistors.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPE42HSJxAk

If you’re still unsure about voltage drop tests, setup a simple circuit of 12v battery and bulb. The battery being the power supply and the bulb being the load, and see the vids on voltage drop tests by eg the trainer Super Mario diagnostics at 4.55m in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYXtC1G ... p=2AExkAIB

Alternatively you could approach the fault via the no crank no start diagnostics in the fsm with with or without obdii, or at a more fundamental level try the initialisation impossible diagnostics?

At some point you’ll notice the various diagnostic strategies intersect.

[boydbino]

UPDATE ON ERROR CODES:

With the car in Diagnostic Mode I am able to read 1 more code than previously:
C0140 (CAN COMMUNICATION MALFUNCTION)

The diagnostic procedure is vague and seems to require SSM only.

[bigBADbenny]

So we might focus on the high speed canbus network, here’s a great video series that focuses on the diagnostics.
Bear in mind the age of your vehicle puts it in the midrange of canbus development, eg it’s not a single network: it has high and low speed canbus, but neither does it have a gateway module.

So we know it’s a high speed can issue, it’s the network between the ecu, bcm and abscm.
As per the video, we can use the wiring diagrams to check the layout of that canbus, see if one single fault is bringing down the house of cards.

We need to map the canbus well before doing any testing since the layout and connected modules dictate the scope of diagnostics.
In all the “er hc” posts on various Subaru forums, the issue is almost always a ground, but which one exactly?
We’ll have more clues once we map the canbus. Eg there might be specifically related grounds.
I’m looking at the second video in the series atm, plus getting to those fsm diagrams but starting with C0140 diagnostics.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbF3idCk4EQ

[bigBADbenny]

So if we lookup C0140, it takes us to LAN(diag)-14…
Obviously you’ll need SSM to do that and currently there’s no connection via obdii.
But in acrobat search, if you keep going through the LAN diag results, you’ll see the SAS, TCM etc.
By following the trail of breadcrumbs in this way we can see in the results if the module is HC or LC.
So now I’m repeating the search but with Er HC, see if that has results…

So I wanted to ask, was your car previously manual swapped?
Edit: no, originally manual (vin check), potentially an auto engine harness was temporarily installed before reverting to the original.

Ok so page IDI-10 has the odometer error code remarks diagram.

Er HC limits the fault to the high speed canbus, not a module, eg integrated unit, EGI, TCM, ABSCM/HU, Vehicle speed pulse, or Wheel speed data…

Keep going through all the results and list the hits:
B0103
B0201 can-HS counter abnormal, the first result with a canbus circuit diagram, looks like it’s the map of the entire high speed network.
Intriguingly, it’s the SAS pin three that’s the only ground in this diagram: LAN(diag)-46
So after searching, it seems your car has no SAS.

I'm going to go back to the explainers at the start of the wiring diagrams section, I want to know what black and white dots at circuit junctions means, as this will inform any further canbus circuit tests, eg location of termination nodes.

So it looks like VDCCM & H/U & STEERING ANGLE SENSOR are optional or not available for your car, being originally and still a manual.
Does this mean your swapping out the steering roll connector is irrelevant?
In the Partsouq diagrams of the roll connector, there's two parts listed via your vin search: without v/cont and with v/cont, yet the same roll connectors are listed. Either way I'd be checking that ground if any or relevant: since you were in there/replaced the roll connector, it can't hurt.

Regardless, what follows LAN(diag)-46 is a 19 step (count em!) canbus diagnostic that appears to involve blind testing by pulling modules and measuring resistance.

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