Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby bigBADbenny » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:47 am

norbs wrote:I reckon AFRs are too high. Mine is tuned for mid to high tens. Perhaps you should invest in a new pump (bigger) and or bigger injectors. Both can be had for not much coin. Both can be purchased from http://www.deatschwerks.com (or some local vendors on here). Both are direct drop in. You will need to scale the injectors, but your tuner SHOULD know how to do that ;-)

Not enough fuel and you ain't going to make power, simple. 8)

What does the butt dyno say anyway ?

Personally, and only because I've been doing this a while, I would ditch the Ecutek and get someone like Matt (aka Kido) or Eric Mineheart (Torqued Performance) to do the tunes. They get you to take logs and will send you an updated ROM which you then flash yourself via a Tactrix (https://www.tactrix.com/) cable/openport device. Ideally an external wideband AFR sensor as well (I have a zetroninx zt-2 (http://www.zeitronix.com/) which can be read by Romraider (for logging) and hasn't failed me in 3 years !!).


You just need to be prepared to go for the drives and take the logs. No biggie. I personally use Eric as he responds with the new tunes same or next day. Knows his stuff really well. Matt is good if you want to go outside the box and use a custom ROM e.g launch control. Can be hard to get hold of sometimes and non-responsive (personal opinion).


So true ^
If that’s the stock pump etc it’s over 10 years old... Do the in-tank bucket filter at the same time...

Also take a look at similar member profiles/mod lists on this forum, as there’s plenty of proven formulas for getting to a safe 180-200atw.

Another essential aspect of safe tuning is road tuning. That’s generally how Matt tunes, and how you will tune if you use Eric. I outlined the process in this post... viewtopic.php?f=56&t=20196&start=0
These guys really know Subaru tuning!

And do check if your boost controller is properly hooked up, that turbo should hold 18psi to redline no problem assuming no leaks and proper setup & tuning.
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby Bayliss » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:51 am

I just spent $1500 on the EcuTek, and are Kido and Torqued Performance in Perth? or is it a communication based thing? I'll definitely invest in a better fuel pump and some injectors. Got plans to change piping coming out of the turbo too.

Hopefully they'll get me close to my 180 awkw goal.
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby bigBADbenny » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:32 pm

Matt does visit WA annually, Eric is solely via email or cloud comms.

Oh I see EcuTek... on whose advice did you get that???

Try those tuners and failing that, try Warick aka ShadowTuned via Gotitwrx or maybe Facebook.

I don’t mean to be rude but it seems you’re lacking in the research and planning side of this project and a bit quick to commit with the spending and mods.

It’s a sure fire way to blow a lot of money and or your engine.
I can see why you’d be really pissed at having sunk about $5-6K into your car with apparently minimal gains.

Personally, I’d take a moment to get up to speed, eg read and understand my and other FAQ’s, aggregate the info and try to get back on track. This is a good start: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=20196&start=0

I’d say step one would be diy logging via tactrix or btssm assuming your tune is safe.
Or to establish if your tune is safe.

Next get it retuned so it’s safe, plan the next complete round of mods to support 180/200atw and line up the install and immediate retune.

All of this takes time and money, and some skill in project management.
In the meantime I’d be staying out of heavy boost for safety.

You do have a gauge of some sort?
Eg via obdii: android phone, Btssm app, Btssm bt adapter or blue vagcom plug via otg.
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=27506

Btssm app, via otg/blue vagcom on an android is currently the least expensive approach to get full ssm logging.
Even better, windows laptop and tactrix.
How all these play with ecutek, idk...

No idea what I’m on about? Search the forum and keep the questions coming!
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby Bayliss » Wed Apr 25, 2018 2:26 pm

bigBADbenny wrote:Matt does visit WA annually, Eric is solely via email or cloud comms.

Oh I see EcuTek... on whose advice did you get that???

Try those tuners and failing that, try Warick aka ShadowTuned via Gotitwrx or maybe Facebook.

I don’t mean to be rude but it seems you’re lacking in the research and planning side of this project and a bit quick to commit with the spending and mods.

It’s a sure fire way to blow a lot of money and or your engine.
I can see why you’d be really pissed at having sunk about $5-6K into your car with apparently minimal gains.

Personally, I’d take a moment to get up to speed, eg read and understand my and other FAQ’s, aggregate the info and try to get back on track. This is a good start: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=20196&start=0

I’d say step one would be diy logging via tactrix or btssm assuming your tune is safe.
Or to establish if your tune is safe.

Next get it retuned so it’s safe, plan the next complete round of mods to support 180/200atw and line up the install and immediate retune.

All of this takes time and money, and some skill in project management.
In the meantime I’d be staying out of heavy boost for safety.

You do have a gauge of some sort?
Eg via obdii: android phone, Btssm app, Btssm bt adapter or blue vagcom plug via otg.
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=27506

Btssm app, via otg/blue vagcom on an android is currently the least expensive approach to get full ssm logging.
Even better, windows laptop and tactrix.
How all these play with ecutek, idk...

No idea what I’m on about? Search the forum and keep the questions coming!


I've done a lot of googling and been going through threads on the forums, but most of my info I got from talking to shops here in Perth, All star garage recommended the blouch 18G XTR and I did some looking and looked to be a decent turbo, so I bought it.
Then found out I'd need a new up pipe so bought new headers too, then the stock intercooler didn't fit so I ordered a temporary front mount kit and thought I might as well order a turbo back exhaust to finish her off. Then sent her in for the tune and all the shop here told me to go through EcuTek since that what most of them used.

Don't really. Know too much myself as most of my mates own commys, I'm the only guy with a turbo in our group but we do most of our own work. Been a hectic learning experience though.

My ultimate goal is 550 whp so I can keep up with my mates and their commys, but with a milk carton + turbo instead of 8 cylinders and many milk cartons.
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby bigBADbenny » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:46 pm

Fair enough.
However you could have taken a few shortcuts with all of the experience written up on this forum ;)

But given your final goal, there’s a very long way to go!

We have just a few members with that sort of power or power potential... say 300-400kw atw...
So look up the member profiles of jslayz, satogixxer, hardwarebob, kiahatsiu... and jacksgtb to name a few.

Your stock auto will support around 200-220atw before requiring upgrades.
Your front mount, turbo and headers will support that with fuelling and airflow mods.

Next step will probably be a built closed deck block, forged internals, big port heads with the trimmings, built auto or 6mt and biggerer supporting everything else bar perhaps your fmic and headers.
Or go for it with a jdm spec C long motor & supporting mods n tune...

Plus you’ll need great tune support the whole way through.
Jslayz would be your local expert on shops & tuners to trust plus Btssm & tactrix expertise :)
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby shav » Wed Apr 25, 2018 5:17 pm

Bayliss wrote:
shav wrote:Is the car auto or manual?

Auto, he said I'd lose power through that too, did want a manual but had trouble finding one and eventually gave up as I didn't wanna ship one from over east.

Ah I see. Im getting 180atw with my stock turbo but similar mods to you with my auto. Id be expecting close to 200 with your turbo for sure. Benny has some pretty good points to consider.
Cheers
Shav

MY07 Subaru Liberty GT Premium Sedan | HKS Panel filter | Pierburg 3 port | Whiteline adj sways F&R | Cusco HD mounts | Whiteline HD front sway links | Anycarlink AL-1080B | Ultrex s/s 3" CBE | Ultrex PU lip spoiler | Invidia s/s dump pipe and 100cel cat | KiDo tuned | DBA T2 rotors | Intima SS brake pads | Mishimoto TMIC | Koya ISR7 wheels | 265L Kobe fuel pump | Diamond Works SI Drive dial | Bilsteins

COSMETIC MODS ON THE WAY

My other toys:
2012 Focus Cayo 2.0 road bike
2015 Cervelo S5 VWD road bike
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby Bayliss » Wed Apr 25, 2018 5:31 pm

Yea definitely a long road ahead, my shopping list currently adds up to 35k excluding labour and transmission/drive train
I've Jslayz build super jealous, total goals.

Will read more I can see now that I may of rushed it a little...
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby jslayz » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:08 pm

Bayliss is a 2.0L shav, 150 to 160awkw on that dyno max.

Need 2.5L to get 200awkw there.

AFRS look great to me, boost control looks to need fine tuning is all.

10.X AFR is very rich!

PM me to arrange a chat if you like Bayliss
CURRENT - ATP GTX 3576 - 22psi - 283.7awkw
OLD - Dom 1.5Xtr - Last dyno 254ahkw, previous 238ahkw, first 224awkw.
My journey thread: http://forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=15523
My Lib Pics here: http://forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=15523&start=570#p370656
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby shav » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:37 pm

Ah I didnt realize his was a 2.0. Fair call. Would make a bit of difference then.
Cheers
Shav

MY07 Subaru Liberty GT Premium Sedan | HKS Panel filter | Pierburg 3 port | Whiteline adj sways F&R | Cusco HD mounts | Whiteline HD front sway links | Anycarlink AL-1080B | Ultrex s/s 3" CBE | Ultrex PU lip spoiler | Invidia s/s dump pipe and 100cel cat | KiDo tuned | DBA T2 rotors | Intima SS brake pads | Mishimoto TMIC | Koya ISR7 wheels | 265L Kobe fuel pump | Diamond Works SI Drive dial | Bilsteins

COSMETIC MODS ON THE WAY

My other toys:
2012 Focus Cayo 2.0 road bike
2015 Cervelo S5 VWD road bike
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Re: Lower dyno numbers than expected, any advice appreciated

Postby bigBADbenny » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:48 pm

Bayliss wrote:Yea definitely a long road ahead, my shopping list currently adds up to 35k excluding labour and transmission/drive train
I've Jslayz build super jealous, total goals.

Will read more I can see now that I may of rushed it a little...


Wow that’s gonna be great!
Potentially on a Willal block??? :shock:

I guess for cutting edge inspiration, check out Tbags time attack Sti on iwsti...
He’s planning to have gotitrex create 2x closed deck destroked engines with lightweight internals, no doubt using GIR’s “Betty” RnD... post 1562 ... 1571 omg!!!

http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gd-members- ... 28?page=79



:)
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