Tuning my 07 sti (manual) 0-100?

[KiDo_Tuning]

Magnifying glass out:

-Tming: yes, you run less timing between 2000rpm and 3000rpm, then ramp it up to be around the same, within 1+/- degree (after KCA added). Surely not enough to claim less timing at peak power, which isn't at 2500rpm.
-Fueling: Almost identical, until higher rpm where you use a little more. 10.40 > 10.88.....
-WG and Boost: You ramp up the boost and WG in the 2000-3000rpm section, while Eric's WG isn't so high

All in all very similar numbers, yours is biased on earlier boost.

Back on topic - what I find interesting is that your Sport DBW values are almost identical to Eric's. Only your S# values are significantly higher.

You say Eric's tune slips. But that would mean your own tune would slip in Sport. What's up with that?

Ignore the 3 port tune, it is different to the dyno Copy and past the 2.3 column over the top and surprise surprise 2.46 degrees LESS timing
Fueling: More load = more fuel in case random load spikes was causing your noise issue. Oddly enough, never went into that region
Weird how it still runs less boost.

Never bothered looking at the throttle maps for comparison? I get full throttle at wastegate pressure(hence full throttle in Intel mode at wastegate pressure etc)

By having no throttle until peak boost and a Target boost table that is wastegate pressure then on to full boost, it 'feels' impressive when it hits full boost as you get a sudden rush of torque. That sudden 'rush' is what feels impressive BUT also causes transmission slip

[alexeiwoody]

If you ask me, you're beating a dead horse here Alexei....

+ 1

If the car feels great to drive, just enjoy it. Just ignore what TH claims... It's just TH trash talk bro.

Yeah... thanks guys, everyone to pm me and you too Daz are right...

I was trying to make sense of what Matt is saying, unfortunately - it doesn't work in real life on my 5EAT.

I just found out that a postFL 5EAT lib which Matt said shifts smoothly out of 1st, was never actually fixed.

I would apologize to Matt if I've been rude. I just get a little vary when the claims don't match real life. Yes, I know there is a tonne of preFL 5EATs shifting well out there, but that's not what we have here and Matt himself wasn't able to get my 1st gear to shift, the last time he tried anyway.

As for the mythical transmission slip - the only time my vf46 car starts to lose to an A45 AMG is the top end after 5000rpm. Who knows, maybe they have transmission slip too

I will post up some results if and when the drags happen.

[<GB>]

seems like some of the transmission tuning are a bit hit or miss!

[alexeiwoody]

Quick update. Car was on Kyp's from ATP dyno this morning, power run done by Vinny the former tuner from Sti Docklands (and one of the people responsible for developing and modifying the tbSti libs). Car is still tuned by e tune from Torqued Performance. Vf46 (terrible I know), auto.

Just a heads up for those who want to argue about the actual dyno numbers - this is a fairly tough Melbourne dyno (similar to the RTR dyno) the difference is usually 10% to Sydney.

Anyway here's the graph, absolutely love the flatness of the curve that should tell you something about how it drives.

And absolutely no sign of transmission slip in gear. Funny that.

20140404_144509.jpg (119.17 KiB) Viewed 3701 times

Not going to the drags anymore due to a possible head gasket issue. Won't be smart to run the boost up until we test it.

[Robbks]

And absolutely no sign of transmission slip in gear. Funny that.

Isn't the only way to see the slip to log Road-speed vs RPM though?
i.e if you double RPM then you should exactly double road speed.

you need a H6 6MT mate
no slip and no HG issues
sorry!

[alexeiwoody]

And absolutely no sign of transmission slip in gear. Funny that.

Isn't the only way to see the slip to log Road-speed vs RPM though?
i.e if you double RPM then you should exactly double road speed.

you need a H6 6MT mate
no slip and no HG issues
sorry!

I apologize I did not post a log because I was there for other reasons measuring other things.

However. According to Vinny, there was no slip rpm vs road speed. He said maybe matt is talking about the Torque converter taking time to lock up, which won't be improved by line pressure as it's holding power properly. It's a case of how the torque converter works. EDIT: Vinny was 100% positive there is no slip in gear. He said it's possible there's slip on changes, but we didn't test that. The guy has owned a dyno and tuned since 1995, and was one of the main people involved in prototyping and testing the lib tbStis for subaru. In summary he knows what transmission slip is and when it's not there....

This tune is an e tune, 1st revision after switching fuel. How much more power do you think we can get if we actually tuned this thing? Or tune it on a dyno, and if my avcs wasn't nearly stock.

It's making nearly 190atw on this dyno on a base etune on a vf46 and you're suggesting it has transmission slip. I may be missing something here - how is it possible to get a smooth normal power curve with transmission slip?

[alexeiwoody]

you need a H6 6MT mate
no slip and no HG issues
sorry!

So far all the evidence I've posted has pointed to one thing only - 5eat holds power very well. The one thing against that - Matt says otherwise. From a video of my dash.

It's forum talk BS that coincidentally drums up the business for matt to tune autos. I still haven't seen matt message me or back up his claims BESIDES talking about rpm to speed ratios. What about road speed, or the gps speed and what about the dyno power? It doesn't add up. Talk vs hard evidence. Lol.

Look a kido tuned H6 with a blown head gasket (sorry jake):
forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=15489&start=120

Maybe that's how I blew my gasket too...back when matt was experimenting with our cars...

On a serious note I'm not questioning Matt's ability as a tuner. What bothers me are the claims that aren't proven.

Matt's saying that he made more power on my car with less timing just by increasing the DBW and throttle maps. BUT it took him many runs to add the 10kw that he did. If it was transmission slip, we would have made 10-20kw+ with simply dropping in the DBW tables.

Let's take a look at that avcs again Matt. You say it's fairly similar. But it's different. You run more avcs for longer and lower and smooth it through the low loads - which as everyone knows can add more torque once the timing and fueling are optimised for the new VE.

Why change timing and how to optimize it? By changing avcs for power we're effectively changing the VE of the engine and increasing the combustion pressures. So we need to lower timing to match. The result - less timing making more torque and earlier. Tuning magic. It also answers the question which no one asked - why would you lower the timing when tuning for power?

And I've no doubt the increased ReqTq helps but even IF it was somehow only down to the dbw, for 10kw out of 160, that's a 6.25% increase for 22% more line pressure. That's a hell of a "transmission slip"!!

Edit: just looked at the WG tables. Holy jesus you ran more WG than Eric on S#. It's nothing bad, but when you have a dyno to help see what's going on, it's so easy to tune up the WG to create better torque and spool. Seriously what's with the claims of DBW creating better torque when you have such a level of difference in tunes, and areas most improved are the ones that differ most everywhere else BUT in the DBW. Say what you will, but you can't answer that one.

Peace out. I give up

[alexeiwoody]

forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=7816&sid=cb6e681b37ce1fc9e0a52ebade4ef47d&start=90

At least two more H6s with head gaskets. At least one more kido tuned in there.

I wonder how closely it's possible to diagnose a HG with a road tune. "Oh your coolant is a bit low...better watch that. Ok I will..."

I wonder how many people with some low coolant levels or leaky coolant were told that it's better not to increase their power until they get it tested? Or was the power tuned up regardless and they simply told to check it out? Shame really.

And while the tuner can't necessarily be held accountable for not diagnosing the issue, it is my opinion that a good tuner would have refused more power if the coolant was under question. And hopefully would have taken longer than 20mins to tune your car.

Although it's understandable when you think of the profit margin when tuning on the road vs tuning on a dyno.

[Kekotic]

Hey Alexei that's a nice result on the dyno.

Is that on 98 or E85?

[KiDo_Tuning]

forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=7816&sid=cb6e681b37ce1fc9e0a52ebade4ef47d&start=90

At least two more H6s with head gaskets. At least one more kido tuned in there.

I wonder how closely it's possible to diagnose a HG with a road tune. "Oh your coolant is a bit low...better watch that. Ok I will..."

I wonder how many people with some low coolant levels or leaky coolant were told that it's better not to increase their power until they get it tested? Or was the power tuned up regardless and they simply told to check it out? Shame really.

And while the tuner can't necessarily be held accountable for not diagnosing the issue, it is my opinion that a good tuner would have refused more power if the coolant was under question. And hopefully would have taken longer than 20mins to tune your car.

Although it's understandable when you think of the profit margin when tuning on the road vs tuning on a dyno.

Dude. Jakey had issues before the tune. The H6 is prone to issues as radiator fans do not come on til 102 degrees for emissions issues. Where is this other one or are you mistaken

I have had no time to read or reply to your messages. You know priorities and all that.
There was no coolant issue no does timing or even power on a H6 cause gasket issues. It is the the radiator fans being set to come on over 100 degrees for emissions.
So a guy who I tuned which was tuned fine and then 2 weeks later had issues because his workshop did not know the DW65c was supposed to have 2 o rings in the pump outlet is my problem? I diagnosed it and got customer back on the road.

Who is this other H6 and before you reply ensure that the HG issue was not BEFORE I ever tuned it or is it a car that the owner tuned himself??

[alexeiwoody]

Hey Alexei that's a nice result on the dyno.

Is that on 98 or E85?

Thanks Kieran, it's the 1st revision of Eric's e85 tune.

Last time we only made 147kw, put a higher flowing cat into the dump and ran e85 on ID1000s. 40kwatw and the torque as you can see - basically turned the VF46 into a twinscroll

[jaydece]

Alexi? as much as your feedback and experience is welcomed.....I myself is getting quite tired of the same broken record ....

It seems to me this is getting quite personal with a HINT of hate....

I'm not coming off as a hater....but enough is enough....on this slip auto topic....

Time to move on...enjoy your car...and keep up the good feedback, advise and experience you do where it counts...

[KiDo_Tuning]

you need a H6 6MT mate
no slip and no HG issues
sorry!

So far all the evidence I've posted has pointed to one thing only - 5eat holds power very well. The one thing against that - Matt says otherwise. From a video of my dash.

It's forum talk BS that coincidentally drums up the business for matt to tune autos. I still haven't seen matt message me or back up his claims BESIDES talking about rpm to speed ratios. What about road speed, or the gps speed and what about the dyno power? It doesn't add up. Talk vs hard evidence. Lol.

Look a kido tuned H6 with a blown head gasket (sorry jake):
forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=15489&start=120

Maybe that's how I blew my gasket too...back when matt was experimenting with our cars...

On a serious note I'm not questioning Matt's ability as a tuner. What bothers me are the claims that aren't proven.

Matt's saying that he made more power on my car with less timing just by increasing the DBW and throttle maps. BUT it took him many runs to add the 10kw that he did. If it was transmission slip, we would have made 10-20kw+ with simply dropping in the DBW tables.

Let's take a look at that avcs again Matt. You say it's fairly similar. But it's different. You run more avcs for longer and lower and smooth it through the low loads - which as everyone knows can add more torque once the timing and fueling are optimised for the new VE.

Why change timing and how to optimize it? By changing avcs for power we're effectively changing the VE of the engine and increasing the combustion pressures. So we need to lower timing to match. The result - less timing making more torque and earlier. Tuning magic. It also answers the question which no one asked - why would you lower the timing when tuning for power?

And I've no doubt the increased ReqTq helps but even IF it was somehow only down to the dbw, for 10kw out of 160, that's a 6.25% increase for 22% more line pressure. That's a hell of a "transmission slip"!!

Edit: just looked at the WG tables. Holy jesus you ran more WG than Eric on S#. It's nothing bad, but when you have a dyno to help see what's going on, it's so easy to tune up the WG to create better torque and spool. Seriously what's with the claims of DBW creating better torque when you have such a level of difference in tunes, and areas most improved are the ones that differ most everywhere else BUT in the DBW. Say what you will, but you can't answer that one.

Peace out. I give up

Yes, since you have no RPM Vs Roller speed... You know like Air boy pointed out in the blog I mentioned. How much reading do YOU dismiss...

Lower coolant temps, optimise quench Vs timing and HG are not an issue. How is it I run 16 degrees LESS timing on richer mixtures than stock on a H6? Sorry, only one tuner I know who I can account head gaskets and lifted head studs too and my email is full of the tuners replies when I got BCC'd in for a fix Want some screen shots?

Full throttle at wastegate pressure means engine is more efficient as it has AIRFLOW and airflow is power. I need more wastegate since I have more flow and less restriction... Physics shows psi is inlet restriction

[Kekotic]

Alexi? as much as your feedback and experience is welcomed.....I myself is getting quite tired of the same broken record ....

It seems to me this is getting quite personal with a HINT of hate....

I'm not coming off as a hater....but enough is enough....on this slip auto topic....

Time to move on...enjoy your car...and keep up the good feedback, advise and experience you do where it counts...

100% agree Justin. Well said.

[alexeiwoody]

Alexi? as much as your feedback and experience is welcomed.....I myself is getting quite tired of the same broken record ....

It seems to me this is getting quite personal with a HINT of hate....

I'm not coming off as a hater....but enough is enough....on this slip auto topic....

Time to move on...enjoy your car...and keep up the good feedback, advise and experience you do where it counts...

Sorry J, I guess it does get a little personal when someone is claiming ridiculous things about your car. And I know not everyone is buying that that's the whole story, still it was frustrating to see how many actually did buy it.


Moving on I'll just leave this here. Filmed before hg issue was diagnosed on the dyno. Complete with transformers soundtrack.