Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby dr20t » Wed Jan 09, 2013 7:30 pm

Absolutely agree Benny

Go for it I say

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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby bigBADbenny » Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:37 pm

it's on! :D
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby jacks-GTB » Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:59 pm

I've got the pop corn out :)

I like this :)
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby bigBADbenny » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:12 pm

Oh Jackson! :oops:
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby alexeiwoody » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:34 pm

I like it benny :) great idea and a fair write up.

Now that all our mafs are clean - let's see if the actual tune will be fixed :)
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby KiDo_Tuning » Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:04 pm

You said it was edited? etc but it looks the same... what am I missing?
Ben knows what the issue was, dennism looked through the tune and had no issue... Pistons with no sign of detonation? Maybe you have heard about the swarf issue in the 08 2.5L engines?

Lets see... 'strangled ideas' might refer to cars that would not accelerate in 5th or 6th car, some would not go uphill in 4th, MAF scalings that were not a logarythmic 'curve', 11.8 AFR's trying to make power and having EGT's skyrocket, WGDC that was flat across the whole table, DBW that was 1:1 which meant throttle tip in was contantly activated so if held at a constant load would run lean when the Tip In timer shut off fuel, 90% WGDC trying to hold flat boost to rev limit rather than keeping the turbo in its efficiency range and getting engine gas flow through the exhaust ports instead of generating exhaust heat...
My11 WRX that did back to back testing on a local dyno, made slightly more power on less boost with richer AFR's and the workshop offered to refund the full costs of customers dyno tune if they could get a copy of my tune after they test drove it... few other cars have had the same thing offered of late(one on the friday before Christmas)
RTR stated to Ain that my AFR's and tune for his car were like a metronome :)

Besides a dyno is a load tuning tool... I prefer 1/4 mile times :)

jaydece wrote:
KiDo_Tuning wrote:CEL's being disabled? Think you might want to go look again, the thread was never removed by admin.


I don't need to look again? ....I wasn't talking about this thread matt? though it has been mentioned here as well...

http://www.rexnet.com.au/forum/index.php?/topic/155846-dyno-day/page__st__330

I was referring to GORIUK's profile page aka Ben which was cleaned up after his incident when he did his end bearing at the springy dyno day....and you got hammered with kido hate because you had tuned his car..

http://www.rexnet.com.au/forum/index.php?/topic/155151-my08-wrx-ben-09/page__st__20

I happened to be there that day spectating...let's just say there were some disappointed and unhappy faces once they saw there results and AFR's....

This wasn't too long after you stated "Everyone claims Melbourne dynos read low... they dont, the cars just dont make power!!"...."I would say Melbourne Subaru tuning is strangled!"

http://www.rexnet.com.au/forum/index.php?/topic/153305-melbourne-wrx-tuner/page__st__20

Big Claims To B Making.....So who's strangled now.....
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby brainy » Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:49 pm

bigBADbenny wrote:Whilst the hornets nest is stirring, I'd like to put a little oil on the water:
alexeiwoody wrote:1. I feel that it is the tuner's responsibility to make sure the sensors are clean before he loads a tune into a car. I knew nothing of sensors or tuning 6 months back, I just paid the money and let Matt do his work. I trusted his expertise. To find out now, that I've been driving on an engine that can go POP! anytime, is not what I paid for.


I think the quoted statement reveals something of concern to tuners in general.
I do agree with aspects of it, and commiserate.

I was in a similar position, a n00b wanting a tune to alleviate some drivability issues with my stock Lib.
The difference was that I had my car serviced and the MAF cleaned, after discussing the drivability issues with Docklands STi, prior to getting the first tune.
They reckoned the car was OK, at least. (damnation with faint praise?)

So I was reasonably confident my car was in tip top shape and the tuner could do his thing unhindered by any mechanical issues.
Regardless of my relative n00bism to actually getting tuned, I considered that basic common sense...

Probably also because I had done plenty of general tune related research here and elsewhere over a period of years...

I'd like to propose a "pre-tune checklist for tune n00bs" in this forum, to assist those who know "nothing of sensors or tuning" but want to get tuned.
At least tuners could direct potential customers to that post, pre-tune. :D


Or you could just use a tuner who actually tells you these things before hand and one that also has a clue about a car mechanically, who isn't just going to tell you "you have a boost leak somewhere" for example.
Perhaps people should ask "Anything i need to do before you tune my car?" Hopefully the answer isn't something like "meet me at a seedy motel car park near an airport for your tune".

My tuners have always told me to make the car as best as it can be mechanically with some examples:
- change oil and filter
- clean air filter
- clean maf sensor
- assess spark plug replacement if required and gap size optimisation.
- enough fuel in the tank
- etc

I personally also recommend a tuner who dyno and road tunes your car. One who has proven results, explains things to you and is able to help with any issues.

I recommend that any one gets a tatrix cable with a laptop and LV your car every now and then so you don't get surprised when you see "red values" everywhere. If you see any issues, take these up with your tuner and he should be more than happy to look into it to fix the issues discovered.

If I'm going to be completely honest, I considered giving a kido tune a go. There was a lot of hype and he seems to be smart with a laptop, but i haven't see any delivered results. I've seen cars make less power after his tunes and that Springy dyno day revealed a lot of unhappy faces who weren't getting dyno figures that resembled what others were getting from different tuners. A lot of rich AFR readings too. Mr KIDO representative himself in the foz was disappointed after his result and when a look like that comes from the endorsor of a tuner it's more than enough for me to stay away.

I've watched a friend of mine go through a 6 month journey only to get less power than what he started with and a pretty bumpy ride along the way. I guess i hope that for the people who do go down this path get a better experience and also don't have a look on their face like the people at the dyno day did...

Good luck to everyone
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby jaydece » Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:21 am

KiDo_Tuning wrote:You said it was edited? etc but it looks the same... what am I missing?


Ehehehe What are you missing? Here let me help you :wink: :)

http://www.rexnet.com.au/forum/index.php?/topic/155151-my08-wrx-ben-09/page__st__20

post #29 - by Martini 935 :) :wink:
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby <GB> » Thu Jan 10, 2013 9:42 am

im yet to hear of any kido tunes with 600plus km out of a tank id like to be pointed in ther right direction along with all the 300awkw standard internal cars too!!

lots of hype and not much proof of anything really!! i take all tuners with a grain of salt cause once you start talking to them they all seem to be fixing up each others tunes.....
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby <GB> » Thu Jan 10, 2013 9:48 am

Image

my car doing 5.2 l per 100 average..... not!!!! it was closer to 10l due to bigger injectors
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby jacks-GTB » Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:05 am

<GB> wrote:im yet to hear of any kido tunes with 600plus km out of a tank id like to be pointed in ther right direction along with all the 300awkw standard internal cars too!!

lots of hype and not much proof of anything really!! i take all tuners with a grain of salt cause once you start talking to them they all seem to be fixing up each others tunes.....



There's guys in the US with 300awkw with stock internals......BUT.......BOOOOM a week later....!!! haha
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby Rome_BRZ » Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:06 pm

I think the main difference here is that the majority of people I see on these forums who get a dyno tune, do not log their car or take learning views. Therefore there is a much smaller percentage of people who notice issues with their tune.

Conversely, the tuning process with Matt for everyone that does remote tunes lends itself to teach you to log your car, and a much higher percentage of his customers log their car at least once, if not on a regular basis. Therefore there is a lot more chance issues come out in the wash.

I'm sure if every single person who has had a dyno tune on this forum logs their car and takes learning views there will be issues galore!

From my own personal experience and the experience of Mick (dr20t) we have been happy with what we have received from Matt for the money paid. His tune on my car has been fine so far (fingers crossed) and is very driveable, and my car has felt like a monster since moving to E85. The only issue I have had so far is that I have an issue getting my car to shift out of 1st gear when driving it on the high boost setting. I'm hoping to sort this out asap.
Last edited by Rome_BRZ on Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby 3rspecb » Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:43 pm

Rome_STI wrote:I'm sure if every single person who has had a dyno tune on this forum logs their car and takes learning views there will be issues galore!


Sorry but this statement is not true.

My last dyno tune was in Apr 2011 (212kwatw). I take a LV every week and all is good :D
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby brainy » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:09 pm

3rspecb wrote:
Rome_STI wrote:I'm sure if every single person who has had a dyno tune on this forum logs their car and takes learning views there will be issues galore!


Sorry but this statement is not true.

My last dyno tune was in Apr 2011 (212kwatw). I take a LV every week and all is good :D


You hear a lot of happy people who are impressed with a kido tune because they've never had their car tuned before with mods. Call it the placebo effect.

Plenty of people out there who get their cars dyno tuned and also log.

But saying issues galore? Issues might occur after some duration because maintenance isn't kept up on the car? It's a lot better than having issues because the latest reflash is still not up to scratch causing the car to run rich, boost spike, boost stutter, poor economy, not shifting properly, pinging, det etc...
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Re: Learning View Snapshots \ Discussions

Postby dr20t » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:54 pm

I still maintain that a car should be dyno tuned full stop, then fine tuned on the road for drivability.

90% of these problems would be blatantly obvious on a dyno and shouldn't change unless volatile memory is triggered with a mechanical fault or upkeep isn't up to scratch.

This is why I can't accept a road tune without verifying on the dyno, with all due respect to Matt. Especially on a highly strung modified setup.

I'm at work but will post a detailed and impartial response later today on my thoughts.

There's alot of discourse here and it needs to be flushed out.
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