The E85 Thread

[michaelkr1]

So I hear Caltex has been winding back E85 since Commodore dropped their E-Flex range last year. Does anyone have any idea how the future of E85 looks in Aus? I was keen for Matt's virtual flex tune, but what's the point if I can't get the fuel. There use to be three near me (Heathcote, Kirrawee and Tempe) and now Tempe is all that's left.

Pretty sure Kirrawee near Lexus still has it? I was there yesterday and saw the label on the pump.

[trolley]

Yep it's at Kirrawee. It had been removed but due to the number of complaints, it's back

[BillyCorgi]

Still at Moorebank and Casula.

[tom_kauf]

Now that I'm on E85, I'm surprised at how long it takes to cold start. I know it's a common issue, but 'cold' to me meant winter temperatures, which we rarely get in North QLD.
Does everyone else's car take 5-6 cranks (rotations of the engine with the starter on) before it starts, at temperatures of around 20-25deg?

On 98 it was always 3 cranks from cold. Warm starts are perfect on E85 - always 3 cranks or less. Priming the pump a few times (Ignition to On, then off, then On again) makes no difference to E85 cold starts.

[BillyCorgi]

Now that I'm on E85, I'm surprised at how long it takes to cold start. I know it's a common issue, but 'cold' to me meant winter temperatures, which we rarely get in North QLD.
Does everyone else's car take 5-6 cranks (rotations of the engine with the starter on) before it starts, at temperatures of around 20-25deg?

On 98 it was always 3 cranks from cold. Warm starts are perfect on E85 - always 3 cranks or less. Priming the pump a few times (Ignition to On, then off, then On again) makes no difference to E85 cold starts.

Yes, starting when the engine has lost all its temperature takes longer.
You need to get some vapourised fuel into the cylinders, and with E85, vapourisation is more of a challenge due to the cooling effect of the ethanol.
Tom. this is what I do......
Turn on key and listen and wait to hear the fuel pump complete is priming cycle.
Crank key momentarily, then stop cranking.
Wait until you count to three.
Crank engine and start.

This does not eliminate the long crank, it just reduces it somewhat.

If that does not excite you, then wind down the driver's window, take some deep breaths and enjoy the smell?
Cheers!

[tom_kauf]

Thanks for the Info Peter .
Yeah I'll try that technique. Matt mentioned something similar the other day, but I hadn't tried it yet. I'll see how much it improves the cranking for me.

I definitely enjoy the smell lol. I don't smell the sweetness that a lot of people talk about, but the alcohol smell (like Vodka imo) is just as good.

[norbs]

You may need to add more fuel to the Fueling-Cranking tables in the tune. Start with %10 more and see how it goes.

[tom_kauf]

You may need to add more fuel to the Fueling-Cranking tables in the tune. Start with %10 more and see how it goes.

Ok cheers, I'll also look into that

[tom_kauf]

I just tried that cold start method, and WOW!! Instant startup! Not even 1 crank and then start, but started on the first crank.

I thought it wouldn't be worth bothering with this technique, but I was totally wrong. My car hadn't been started for a few days, so totally cold - outside temps in the carport where it lives were about 23deg.

[norbs]

I just tried that cold start method, and WOW!! Instant startup! Not even 1 crank and then start, but started on the first crank).

I thought it wouldn't be worth bothering with this technique, but I was totally wrong. My car hadn't been started for a few days, so totally cold - outside temps in the carport where it lives were about 23deg.

Nice one Definitely helped my cold starting when I went to bigger injectors. Is a shit feeling when your car takes those extra long cranks to fire up.

Do you have flex tune? If so then I guess this is one area it can't compensate for. Probably not in the code.

[tom_kauf]

Ah ok, yeah - maybe I'm lucky I'm still on stock injectors then lol.

Yes, flex fuel tune as of a few weeks ago when we got E85 locally.
I see, yeah that could well be.

[KiDo_Tuning]

I just tried that cold start method, and WOW!! Instant startup! Not even 1 crank and then start, but started on the first crank).

I thought it wouldn't be worth bothering with this technique, but I was totally wrong. My car hadn't been started for a few days, so totally cold - outside temps in the carport where it lives were about 23deg.

Nice one Definitely helped my cold starting when I went to bigger injectors. Is a shit feeling when your car takes those extra long cranks to fire up.

Do you have flex tune? If so then I guess this is one area it can't compensate for. Probably not in the code.

Flex tune accounts for it. No fuel needed to be added, it starts first crank on the method I use. No anti-drain back valve in the pumps, lose pressure so wait for it to build up pressure behind the injectors. Had guys at Thredbo starting first crank

[norbs]

I just tried that cold start method, and WOW!! Instant startup! Not even 1 crank and then start, but started on the first crank).

I thought it wouldn't be worth bothering with this technique, but I was totally wrong. My car hadn't been started for a few days, so totally cold - outside temps in the carport where it lives were about 23deg.

Nice one Definitely helped my cold starting when I went to bigger injectors. Is a shit feeling when your car takes those extra long cranks to fire up.

Do you have flex tune? If so then I guess this is one area it can't compensate for. Probably not in the code.

Flex tune accounts for it. No fuel needed to be added, it starts first crank on the method I use. No anti-drain back valve in the pumps, lose pressure so wait for it to build up pressure behind the injectors. Had guys at Thredbo starting first crank

tom must not have your tune then?? otherwise how do u explain his results after tweaking the fuel cranking tables?? how long does one need to wait to build pressure? sweep of the dials should be ample time no?

[tom_kauf]

tom must not have your tune then?? otherwise how do u explain his results after tweaking the fuel cranking tables?? how long does one need to wait to build pressure? sweep of the dials should be ample time no?

I do have Matt's tune. The technique Matt talks about is the one Peter also talked about above. Works great! I just hadn't done it yet after Matt first told me about it at the local tune.

[KiDo_Tuning]

tom must not have your tune then?? otherwise how do u explain his results after tweaking the fuel cranking tables?? how long does one need to wait to build pressure? sweep of the dials should be ample time no?

Because I know it is my tune and he would not be able to tweak the tables himself since the ROM has a few table locations moved

Actually worked it out when people were getting great starting on the factory pumps... fit aftermarket pumps and suddenly cold start had gone to shit. Fuel pump duty is 100% at cold start so I knew it was not the issue. Running more cold cranking pulsewidth can make it WORSE

Fit one of these
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=21043&p=379609&hilit=mscn#p379609
No more issues

How long does it take to prime a fuel system to get full line pressure after a pump replcement? 2 or 3 key turns