club.liberty.asn.au

So I had my first low speed emergency stop yesterday due to a numpty turning right coming from the opposite direction - right in front of me.

I am pissed I did not foresee it earlier as it was the classic situation where I was driving in the left lane in a dual carriageway road and the right lane was fairly busy. someone in the right lane in their infinite wisdom left that wonderful considerate gap for the guy in the opposite direction to turn through. He didn't look for me in the left lane did he!!

Anyway I stopped ok - from only 40km/h that I was doing.

BUT - I have noticed this plenty of time before and now its pissed me off. The ABS software in the car is shit!
It triggers waaay too early and allows no lockup at all even at very low speeds - increasing stopping distance. And forget it if there is a bump in the road - it almost completely releases the brakes momentarily. Lift a wheel confuses it too.

I have no doubt gthe ABS system itself is top notch, but like most things is compensating for the lowest common deoominator (average/crap driver), and attempts to ensure full control of the vehicle is maintained at all times. Some people freak out if the car slides at all.

Also to support this is the expereience I had owning the MY02 STi where it did have an aggressive software map in the ABS that would allow quite a bit of lockup (particularly from one rear under cornering) It was FAR superior in how well it stopped and the brake package was the same. I also believe this is why the BP5/BL5 Liberty did not do well in the Motor magazine shootout PCOTY braking test - taking longer than the average rollerskate to come to a complete halt.

Now I would never profess to beat a good ABS system - particularly at high speed and in adverse conditions, but at low speed - I am confident I could stop quicker - and forget on gravel!!

For those who track their BP5/BL5 - doesn't this shit you on bumpier tracks? do you simply pull the fuse?
I don't want to lose the ABS system - simply have it more aggressive (or should that be less aggressive )in its operation.

I would have thought it was possible to flash new software onto it somehow.

Anyone heard of it being done?

Hi mate,

I think in 40 KM/H and ABS is turn on when u brake hard, it's similar to any japanese car, even city car.

The germans like BMW or Merc, VW and stuff, even work on 5 km/h.

I think it's ok if the ABS react on 40km/h.

Cheers

re-read my post,

I am not worried about it operating at 40km/h, but the way it operates

It is likely a very simple feedback pid controller, just like the turbo dynamics tables .... but is not in the ecu definitions and supposedly completely separate from the ecu.

I'll ask Serge, but I think the SSM can talk to it. Not that that will do you any good.

Completely agree with that Boxer. In fact I was back to Subaru within the first week of buying the car questioning why the ABS kicked in so ridiculously early (made worse by a series of downhill bumpy entries to corners on the way to work that gave a few heart in mouth moments). Usual response of it's working within limits was the response. I will be ecstatic if you can find a way to calibrate them to how they should be.

if the ABS maps sit in the actual ECU, you should be able to fiddle with it. but i don't know where they live and have never looked.

I thought it was just that I needed better tyres

The ABS does come on sooner running RE-001 compared to the original RE-050A, but then again I have also upgraded the pads and flushed good fluid through since I change the tyres too...

teK-- wrote:I thought it was just that I needed better tyres

The ABS does come on sooner running RE-001 compared to the original RE-050A, but then again I have also upgraded the pads and flushed good fluid through since I change the tyres too...

That may not be the only reason but the tyres play a very important part in stopping and how the abs reacts. When i bought my car it came with crappy Achilles tyres and the abs was so sensitive it drove me mad. Then i put some decent tyres on and problem solved.

Also public roads are seldom perfectly smooth too

adhar wrote:

teK-- wrote:I thought it was just that I needed better tyres

The ABS does come on sooner running RE-001 compared to the original RE-050A, but then again I have also upgraded the pads and flushed good fluid through since I change the tyres too...

That may not be the only reason but the tyres play a very important part in stopping and how the abs reacts. When i bought my car it came with crappy Achilles tyres and the abs was so sensitive it drove me mad. Then i put some decent tyres on and problem solved.

I wish it was that simple. Granted better tyres do help but the problem is the sensitivity of the electronics. I've tried multiple tyres and multiple suspension setups and whilst it is fine when the road is smooth, as soon as a bump is introduced it turns into jelly pedal. Didn't the earlier Impreza's have a similar problem? I can recall reading alot of people complaining about it and getting no joy from Subaru.............

Personally I found how the ABS system worked in my GT to be rather good... Mind you, I'm not expert, but I've never had in real negative experiences.

If you want an overly sensitive ABS system, try the one in the Mazda 3! SP23 to be more specific. ABS would kick in under very light breaking if there was so much as a bump in the road... & in Sydney, let's face it, that's almost all the time.

How about in high end cars like any of the German big three? I haven't had the experience of driving many of those so perhaps others here could comment.

The problem I see is how does the software differentiate a tyre being unloaded due to uneven road surface , compared to exceeding traction on a smooth surface.

i find it's operation awful in my '05 2.0L and ok in my '07 gt-b.

teK-- wrote:How about in high end cars like any of the German big three? I haven't had the experience of driving many of those so perhaps others here could comment.

The problem I see is how does the software differentiate a tyre being unloaded due to uneven road surface , compared to exceeding traction on a smooth surface.

Most euro car use modules made by Bosch, The ABS is governed by inputs from the traction control, launch control, electronic brake force distributor, slip sensors (found in the hubs), interesting torque modules found in the diff and pad thickness sensors.

The only way to over ride these inputs is too physically disconnect them and plug in a over ride loom…….

teK-- wrote:How about in high end cars like any of the German big three? I haven't had the experience of driving many of those so perhaps others here could comment.

I've had the chance to drive a fair few Euro cars like VW's, BMW's, etc & have found there ABS functionality to be very similar to the Liberty's.

Remember, the Gen 4 Liberty's were designed to be competition to some of the Euro cars... So the fact they seem to drive in a similar fashion doesn't supprise me one bit