Failsafe Pt2: 4 Channel EGT

[jslayz]

Fuel tune trim as here : http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2426096&highlight=outfront&page=21

J

[GT-B Spec R Pilot]

BBB, You may have already looked into it but if you happen to be anywhere near a general aviation airport go and have a chat to an aviation maintenance company dealing with large piston engined aircraft maintenance. CHT & EGT management is part of every commercial pilot's training and the larger piston engine aircraft with turbocharged engines are all fitted with CHT & EGT gauges. It may be possible to modify a 2nd hand CHT/EGT monitoring system from an aircraft for less than a new automotive one, particularly if you can pick one up from the states which has a lot of ageing g.a. Airframes. I know this sounds a bit of an 'out there' kind of idea but f you don't ask, you will never know. Cheers

[bigBADbenny]

Spot on!
There are some seriously cool 4 way gauges available for piston engine aircraft...
The catch is they don't appear to have provision for logging output.
The Motorsport solutions allow logging but require 4x 2" gauges.

Thus the interest in the Auber EGT units which do it all in a small form factor.

[jakey]

The catch is they don't appear to have provision for logging output.

All this shit and no logging??? Sheesh!!?!



BTW - with all the gauges and logging you have, your 'cockpit' won't look dissimilar soon.

[GT-B Spec R Pilot]

Spot on!
There are some seriously cool 4 way gauges available for piston engine aircraft...
The catch is they don't appear to have provision for logging.

I am not so sure about that. Flight data recorders have been mandatory on RPT aircraft for some time & engine operating parameters are part of the data recorded. Whilst the recording functionality may not be compatible in its native format with whatever you are using to log engine data at present, an analogue or digital signal output can easily be recorded and mapped to a reference spanned signal whether or not that is displayed on a gauge.

Large Marine Diesel engines do exactly what you are talking about (fuel trim on a per cylinder basis) in real time BUT each cylinder effectively has its own ECU with a lot of sensors feding data to it real time (we are talking nano second latency) and in turn the cylinder ECU's are controlled by a master ECU. Power consumption of the ECU's, the space they take up & weight are not issues that are relatively important in that environment though.

The technology is certainly there, the challenge is modifying it to achieve what you are after at a price you are comfortable with. I certainly think you are on to something if you can make it work cheaply & effectively enough to be helpful tuning & providing the safety margin you mentioned. Good luck!

[GT-B Spec R Pilot]

The catch is they don't appear to have provision for logging output.

All this shit and no logging??? Sheesh!!?!



BTW - with all the gauges and logging you have, your 'cockpit' won't look dissimilar soon.

Impressive as that is, I was thinking more like a Ceesna 421 or a PA-31 Navajo instrumentation ...in the context of the op's comments... However as a pilot, give me the U2 anyday!

[bigBADbenny]

this one is divine:

This would suit if it has logging output... Just inquiring now...

It doesn't offer any 0-5v outputs (I read the manual) but might work in conjunction with the Innovate or AEM thermocouple amps.

4 cylinders is about the sane limit for EGT gauges, after that single displays with rotary switches are preferred, ot just multiple displays...

[Boostaddict]

They look awesome!!!

Will be an interesting outcome from this topic

+ 1 for this topic!!

[GT-B Spec R Pilot]

This may be suitable and at $250 US not that expensive.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/i ... 105719.php

or a much more elaborate option, http://www.avweb.com/news/maint/egt_and ... 791-1.html about half way down the page under common indications. With a USB port on the front I am guessing there would be logging functionality inbuilt.

Some thermocouples that may be helpful here http://www.insightavionics.com/probes.htm

[bigBADbenny]

This may be suitable and at $250 US not that expensive.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/i ... 105719.php

That's the same one I linked a pic of, just a different screen.

Its a Pandoras Box - solutions with great sophistication including logging definitely exist in the world of avionics, but they start at around 2K and go up, up and away from there

Eg: http://sarasotaavionics.com/avionics/g2_4cyl_2in

http://www.avweb.com/news/maint/egt_and ... 791-1.html
Interesting reading

Keep it up, I'm wagering that 4x Auber EGT kits plus an Innovate SSI-4 is the least expensive 4 channel EGT monitoring/alarm/failsafe/logging solution.
The SSI-4 should allow logging integration with RomRaider...

I'm saving up to do this next year: meaning plenty of time to fine tune the possibilities.

[jakey]

This affordable option seems like it does everything + more?/??

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/i ... ltherm.php

and this one?
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/i ... 105719.php

And possibly some here?
http://www.zeitronix.com/order/order.htm

Man i'm having too much un-educated fun

OH: And this seems like it may be a valuable read? : https://www.savvyanalysis.com/articles/ ... s-debunked

[bigBADbenny]

Thermometer TL-2624 looks promising.
I had a chat to a mate who is an aircraft service engineer, pilot and so on.
He said multiple channel EGT, CHT etc is a relatively new thing in aviation.
So no piles of decertified obsolete instruments in that market.

He was like "the (single) EGT in my plane is on the blink, so there's always the rule of thumb: pull the choke out till the engine sputters, then push it in in half a pinkie"

[GT-B Spec R Pilot]

This may be suitable and at $250 US not that expensive.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/i ... 105719.php

That's the same one I linked a pic of, just a different screen.

Its a Pandoras Box - solutions with great sophistication including logging definitely exist in the world of avionics, but they start at around 2K and go up, up and away from there

Keep it up, I'm wagering that 4x Auber EGT kits plus an Innovate SSI-4 is the least expensive 4 channel EGT monitoring/alarm/failsafe/logging solution.
The SSI-4 should allow logging integration with RomRaider...

I'm saving up to do this next year: meaning plenty of time to fine tune the possibilities.

There are certainly a lot of possibilities depending on your wallet! I have often wondered why more of the aviation industry technology hasn't found its way into cars. For example, you could get rid of the majority of the switches and buttons on and around the dash/console and get rid of the instrument cluster completely and replace the lot with a couple of touch screens/displays along similar lines to an aircraft glass cockpit. One display screen for engine performance data, one display for vehicle performance data, one touch screen for entertainment controls and one touch screen for climate/lighting control with all screens able to display all data and configurable to suit the user. Tablets are cheap nowdays and the amount of wiring and switches that would be redundant would make for a nice weight saving. The technology has proven itself in aviation so that isn't the barrier. I suspect re-tooling & re-engineering costs would be an issue up front but pay off by virtue of being able to roll out practically identical technology across a range of car models. If only someone would give me a shed load of $$$$ to make a working prototype...

[jakey]

Biggest issue is probably distractions to drivers i'd say

[bigBADbenny]

You have a point.
But the reason for gauges is simply to look at a peak temp, or a glance at the values in realtime.

The failsafe and or alarms, if any, should do the real work of alerting the driver.

Anyhow this unit looks promising: COMBINED ENGINE INSTRUMENT TL-3724
Good work Jake
4 x egt or cht channels plus more and serial output.