club.liberty.asn.au

Hey guys,

I'm looking to buy my first Liberty (3.0 spec B) and can't decide between buying a 6 speed manual or 5 speed auto as I don't have the means to test drive both of them.

If you have either of transmission, I'd like to know what you think of it.

Some of the questions I have are:
- Which transmission can take more abuse? (this might be a controversial idea but i would like to do lots of work to H6 motor and dont want to destroy the transmission)
- How responsive are the paddle shifters in the auto?
- How well does the auto transmission perform without manual shift input?
- Is the manual nice to use? (e.g. is it smooth or clunky and awkward to find gears)
- How do both perform on track or in hills?
- Do the have similar top speeds? (I hear the manual has a much faster 0-100 time)

any other thoughts you have on either of the transmissions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks everyone


Disclaimer: this is my first post on this forum and im not even sure im doing it in the right place so please go easy on me ahah

Manual's definitely faster.
My shift was pretty sloppy, but Corgi Werx do a pretty good rejuvenation kit which fixes worn bushes. I reckon Manual from my experience is a bit more durable but others may disagree. I did have a few issues with my transmission, with both the centre diff (pretty common I think) and the transfer case, but I got mine for a bit cheaper because of these.
-Seb.

Get the manual, that is all.

Tresidder17 wrote:Hey guys,

I'm looking to buy my first Liberty (3.0 spec B) and can't decide between buying a 6 speed manual or 5 speed auto as I don't have the means to test drive both of them.

If you have either of transmission, I'd like to know what you think of it.

Some of the questions I have are:
- Which transmission can take more abuse? (this might be a controversial idea but i would like to do lots of work to H6 motor and dont want to destroy the transmission)
- How responsive are the paddle shifters in the auto?
- How well does the auto transmission perform without manual shift input?
- Is the manual nice to use? (e.g. is it smooth or clunky and awkward to find gears)
- How do both perform on track or in hills?
- Do the have similar top speeds? (I hear the manual has a much faster 0-100 time)

5EAT:
- is faster in a straight line, through the hills/twisties they're about the same
- Nicer to drive as a daily, or in traffic
- Paddles are fairly responsive. Auto/Drive mode is decent - if you buy the postFl Liberty with SI drive. The preFl without SI drive aren't as nice - have to use manual mode to have as much fun. Paddles are also much nicer than steering wheel buttons
- Without a VB mod (modifying the control mechanism (aka Valve Body) to run more pressure between clutch-packs , similar effect to a better clutch on a manual) or at least a good ECU tune, shifts can be a little sluggish at WOT.

Manual:
- Feels faster, feels more engaged, but more effort to use
- One of the best manual gearboxes available in this price range ($8-20k).
- Potentially cheaper and easier to build for serious power. For up to 250kwatw (double factory power) - they're about the same cost to modify (clutch for manual, Valve Body mod for auto), if you're aiming for 300kw or above - the auto will need better clutch-packs and some additional work...
- Manual gets more "respect" from manual enthusiasts (most of whom haven't owned a well modified auto or DSG).


Just realised you're looking at an H6 - without a turbo, you won't ever hit those numbers, so at worst (not necessary, but awesome) - expect to to pay about $1000 (+$500 for complete fluid change and labour) for a valve body mod for an auto, and you'll have one of the crispest, sharpest shifting Subaru autos in the country (not enough people have these ). Really miles over a stock auto or anything an ECU tune can do. Although a good ECU tune is very helpful to an auto.





TL; DR.

Both are great boxes in their own areas, auto will really shine with a VB mod, just like manual will really shine with a good clutch. Costs about the same. Auto is effortless to drive (big ++ for 90-95% of daily driving), Manual "feels" a little more impressive (in the 5-10% you might really flog it).

Depends also on the use of the car.
I use mine as a Grand Tourer style vehicle, and the auto is great for this mode.
Si drive is a big advantage.
Go for a manual if you are more serious about track work.

Hexamod VB Kit? Who does these in Sydney?

Thankyou everybody for the input

Alexeiwoody, you've said that both are equally fast in a straight line. Carsales claims the manual can go 0-100 in 6.9sec but the auto takes 8.2sec. Do these numbers not account for the time it takes to shift gears in the manual?

Does anyone have a link to the valve body mod so i can have a better look at what it is?

Thanks guys

I prefer manual cars but my 5EAT is loads of fun to drive.

Tresidder17 wrote:Thankyou everybody for the input

Alexeiwoody, you've said that both are equally fast in a straight line. Carsales claims the manual can go 0-100 in 6.9sec but the auto takes 8.2sec. Do these numbers not account for the time it takes to shift gears in the manual?

Does anyone have a link to the valve body mod so i can have a better look at what it is?

Thanks guys

I said "Auto is faster", not that they're equal. As for carsales - how do you think a same weight/same engined car can have a whole second difference in acceleration, when the auto changes gears quicker and doesn't lose torque during the shift? Whoever tested it would have absolutely dropped the clutch and launched in the manual and then just rolled off the line in the auto, instead of brake boosting and launching. Silly and inaccurate. And let's not forget that one has longer gears and less shifting - the 6 speed is not a straight line performance box.

Compare all the 1/4 times on this forum and you'll see at least a few 250kw autos, on stock engines running low 12s, while 320kw+ forged internal, manual libs are struggling to break 12.5s.

Kewish Auto in Melbourne are the best to speak to about Valve body mods.

Seems to me the thing not mentioned here is that the H6 has less low end torque than a 2.5T, and with a 6mt box you will be changing gears a lot more - I have experience in both. Of you enjoy lots of gear changing, go for a 6mt/H6. If not...H6+5EAT, or consider a 2.5T. A vigorously driven H6 with use more fuel than a 2.5T in my experience.
I do not rate an H6 with 6mt as a tow vehicle at all - expect regular clutch changes.
I suggest you tell us more about your major driving scenarios
jp 08 gtb 6mt wagon.

Alexeiwoody, I absolutely agree with you on what you said about their 0-100 times. Having such wildly different times does not make sense and i thought it would be best to ask in case i was missing something, I agree that it is likely to be very inaccurate.

jp928, you are right about the lack of low end torque. I've owned my 5eat for 6+ months now and love it. however i havent driven a 6mt to get an opinion on it and im not desperate to try a 6mt as im quite happy with the 5eat and dont want to ruin it for myself haha. As for the 2.5T, its not really an option for me as I'm on P2s in south australia which means most turbo cars are banned.

Crazy about turbo being banned for P2s - the 2.5T is, according to published specs, only 4Kw more than an H6. When you say 'most', is it worth investigating if a 2.5T is banned?
Just looked it up - Liberty GT is a no goer! Also I note 'post 1994 Porsches' are banned. So a 350hp 928 (1992-5) is OK, as is a 930 turbo and lots of other very fast models. Crazy stuff.
jp 08 gtb 6mt wagon

yeah unfortunately the 2.5T is banned. I think the general rule is that turbo cars that use a turbo for efficiency rather than performance are allowed even though some of those vehicles can still be quite fast.