Centre Diff Binding

Posts specific to the 3.0 litre NA H6 engine

Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Thu Jul 23, 2015 9:22 pm

All I can contribute is that the switch looks like this when ordered:

And yes, the washer is about 2mm thick.

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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:35 pm

But back on the topic of Centre Diffs, I got my car back today!! :D Only took 5 weeks :? (1 day short of 5 weeks, to be exact).

The reverse switch is excellent....so far. As soon as the gearbox goes into reverse, the lights come on. No matter how much I wiggle the gear shifter, the lights remain on. Hopefully it stays that way.

The bad news is, the Clunking noise when turning is still there a little bit (MUCH better, but not fully gone). I'll get them to check if I also have a slight steering issue, or what it could be. I haven't been able to test it much at low speed, just went for a spirited drive.

I have serious doubts about the stuff-up with the Centre Diff I ordered from Tuspeed being the wrong one. Adam was happy to give me store credit, so that's fine. And I have no evidence either way on the Diff, but I half suspected the dealership had an issue with me supplying parts (although they were happy to quote a price for just labour). Today when I picked up the car they also claimed the Reverse Switch and Gear Shifter Bushings were wrong. But the joke is on them, because the dealer's own parts section supplied those. And when I got home, I noticed that the Part# they billed me for was the EXACT same as what I had :angry2: . So they'll definitely hear about that next week.
Last edited by tom_kauf on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:50 pm

In a lighter note, the clutch is AMAZING 8) . Jim Berry is basically the reason the car took so long (he moved workshops and semi-retired, as well as having surgery).

The pickup is too low for me though (it feels like it's about 2cm off the floor - probably 5cm in reality). It's adjusted fine, but doesn't feel natural.
Does anyone know if that can be adjusted easily (ie on the pedal end, or linkage)?

I was lucky to have a 240mm clutch, which means he could use a really good Sachs pressure plate :D . It's weird because mine is an MY09, and later model Gen4s like mine often have 230mm clutches. Anyway, I'm not complaining - and that's been discussed on this Forum, basically no one knows for sure until the clutch is out.

The pedal weight is no firmer than stock, which is great for me (especially in traffic).
The clutch bite is fantastic. Despite that, the clutch is still very progressive - definitely no problem for daily driving. Really good on hard downshifts, and I now get wheelspin on launches which I never used to despite my pretty sticky Bridgestone S001 tyres (although the roads I was on weren't super-grippy, but still impressive). I've always had to turn traction control off, otherwise it kicks in, but the approx solid 1/4sec - 1/2sec of wheelspin is new.

The shifter is pretty notchy now with the STi trans mount and last stock shifter bushes replaced (and STi Short Shifter that I had previously). For me it's almost too notchy - but think it will improve a bit once it loosens up. The Short Shifter had definitely loosened up a tiny bit in the last 6 months, which was nicer for daily driving. I'm glad I didn't go with the GroupN mount. There's a lot more driveline vibration in some situations eg when I'm trying to cruise in a gear that's too low. I know I should just change gear, but sometimes I cruise through large roundabouts in 6th. That used to be fine, even if I could feel the engine wasn't at optimal revs for a little bit (but it didn't vibrate through the driveline much). But now the whole vibration is transferred through to the cabin quite a bit. But that's ok...
The section of the shifter inside the cabin now has a weird squeak. No idea why, but the plastic/nylon ball joints will just get some more grease at some stage.

Sorry for the long posts, but that's the full review....
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby 666 » Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:59 pm

Thanks for that write up Tom, really useful information. With Jim Berry has he retired or just doing less in preparation for retirement? I'd like to know because I'll be clutch shopping soon and Jim is where I would like to get the clutch from. Also I might have missed it but what exactly was the the problem with the centre diff? Wrong VIN or USDM/ADM/JDM differences that caused the mix up?

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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:33 pm

To update the above issues. I adjusted the pedal myself (or rather the slave cylinder?) to make the bite point a bit higher and the cluth feel more natural. These helped a lot:
http://www.iwsti.com/forums/drivetrain-components/38038-adjusting-stock-clutch-2.html
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ScZFQ0j5beY

The squeaking were the new bushes in the top section of the shifter. Turns out they replaced those, even though my STi shift assembly and those bushes were less than a year old. I wanted them to replace the ones right before the transmission (they were the only ones I hadn't done), not the top ones. Oh well, another time... Access to the top bushes was easy from inside the cabin - some silicon grease and no more squeaks! And notchiness has also reduced a bit after a few days of driving.
They refunded me the money for the switch. Apparently mine had the wrong connector. Whatever they say :roll: .

And I got them to drive with me in the car today - the clunking that remains might be a CV shaft they think. It's more from the front of the car. It's going in on Fri for a quick check. After that the car is away for 2 weeks, so that won't be fixed before then.
Last edited by tom_kauf on Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:38 pm

666 wrote:Thanks for that write up Tom, really useful information. With Jim Berry has he retired or just doing less in preparation for retirement? I'd like to know because I'll be clutch shopping soon and Jim is where I would like to get the clutch from. Also I might have missed it but what exactly was the the problem with the centre diff? Wrong VIN or USDM/ADM/JDM differences that caused the mix up?

Rob

No problem :D. He said he'll still be doing Subarus and Mitsubishis etc, just not (as he said) "that european crap" lol. He's moved from somewhere near Brisbane to Stanthorpe if I remember correctly. So his workshop is smaller and he's doing less work, but you'll still be able to get a clutch for you Lib 8) . The surgery he had should all be sorted now, so no problems there. I think he said he pulled something while moving.
Just give him a heads-up that you're wanting a clutch from him. But to know what type you have, you just have to literally pull the clutch to see - there's really no consistency with our cars.

Apparently the Centre Diff was wrong because it had an extra gear and was for a USDM model. Adam at Tuspeed (who ordered the Diff for me from Japan - saving almost $500) double-checked the VIN, and still thinks it should've been right. The VIN that I gave them was right. But after all the other little parts that were supposedly wrong, I'm not sure I fully believe the dealer when they say those parts were wrong. But I was interstate at the time, so I couldn't see for myself. My car is a normal ADM model. In the end the dealer ordered the part themselves, and that was the right one - but MUCH more expensive. Both were Subaru Genuine parts btw.
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Wed Aug 05, 2015 11:02 am

Shaheenis wrote:Wow this is a really informative thread.

I have experienced diff binding in my old wagon (4EAT) where the centre diff would bind due to a faulty valve solenoid. It would bind and you would feel the wheels locking up and when doing tight low speed turns you could hear and feel the wheels spinning, especially in gravel.

It makes me wonder whether a symptom I am having on my Gen4 could be the early signs of this. I don't feel any wheel binding as such but do get a rotational clunking feeling at low speed cornering but it feels to be coming from the front left more and I think it is only ever the outside wheel. I had been thinking this related to a bilstein knock. I only feel it at low speeds and it isn't a clicking like a CV, more rotational clunk/flapping sound if that makes sense. I will have to pay more attention and see if it does it when the oil is cool but the first time I noticed it was after a drive up to Montville in the mountains so would have been quite warm.

My car also has a full service history and to my knowledge only ever had tyres replaced as a set from factory.

Hi Shaheenis,
As you might've read in my later posts, my centre diff issue is fixed, but I still have a little bit of a noise - and now that I've read through the earlier posts it sounds exactly what you desribed! :shock:
I guess I mistook the centre diff binding noise for the clunk that you described. But now I understand that they're different. The symptoms/sounds are similar, but still quite different. I guess one masked the other on my car. It always happens when turning (mostly when doing a u turn or low speed parking), but also when turning at a 90deg intersection - then usually only a single clunk vs the multiple clunks when turning for longer while eg parking.

I took it back to the dealer, and they test-drove it. They concluded *it could be a bilstein knock*, but aren't sure. I find that hard to believe, because the suspension isn't under much load at low speed, and why is it a repeated clunk-clunk-clunk? And I never have any clunking while driving - no matter how bumpy the surface. All the other things (CV shaft etc) were inspected and no faults found. They just said don't worry about it :? .

And like yours, mine is definitely only there when warm. So maybe you can save yourself a lot of money and look for another cause of this clunk that isn't the centre diff. I'd be very keen to find the source of it - it's just annoying.

Btw, I'm originally from the Sunshine Coast (used to live in Kawana, my mum now lives in Maleny :) ). I've never had my Liberty down for the drive up the range to eg Montville. One day I'll drive it down from NQLD!
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby Shaheenis » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:09 pm

Tom, so now we can search for the problem together :). Mine is no worse since I noticed it almost 2 years ago now. I wasn't planning on replacing the center diff unless things got much worse but sounds like it isn't the diff based on your experience. I don't think it is the Bilsteins, talked to Miles at A&M Auto about it and he said Bilstein knock is really noticeable and like you said the conditions under when it happens are not much movement on the shock. Mine definitely relates to something rotational. I would love to try some replacement driveshafts including CVs just to see if it went away. Let us know when you come down, we will organise a cruise. Great spot the Sunshine Coast hinterlands ;).
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Wed Aug 05, 2015 11:59 pm

Sounds good Tim :) . Yeah, it has to be rotational because of the repeated clunk-clunk-clunk. One day I'll go to an empty carpark and just drive around in circles. It definitely does it during right-hand turns (eg U-turns), but I expect it to be the same for left-hand turns. I'll find a thread on here about the Billie knock, and we'll see what other say. I still think it really doesn't make sense to be suspension knock, especially since our knock only gets noticeable when the engine/driveline is warm.

I had one CV Shaft replaced earlier this year, when the boot split (the right-hand one). Does your noise come from the front? Mine definitely sounds like it's from the front of the car. So much so that they first suspected the other old CV shaft. But apparently looked fine when they inspected it (for free, since I already spent so much money).

Problem is, I don't have anyone else I can take it to :?. I've already gone through 2 other so called 'performance' workshops, which were terrible. And whenever someone asks on Facebook who a good mechanic is in Townsville, people say 'there's no one, do it yourself' lol. So, the dealer has actually been the best so far. I have one final recommendation for a local GTSpecB owner (also called Tim). I'll take it there some time.

Thank you, that'd be awesome 8) .
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby BillyCorgi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:03 pm

Does anyone on this post have a failed 6MT Centre Differential Viscous Coupling that they would like to donate to science?
I am preparing to start a diff rebuilding operation that would be beneficial to all forum members.
Cheers!

Look at this post viewtopic.php?f=45&t=30784
Get your Short Shift Adaptor viewtopic.php?f=68&t=30525
Get your Gear Shift Rejuvenation Kit viewtopic.php?f=68&t=31240
Get your Centre Differential Rebuild viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31089
Want a custom built Brake Cylinder Stopper? viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31321
Need to hire a Guard Rolling Machine? viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31899
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby tom_kauf » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:46 pm

BillyCorgi wrote:Does anyone on this post have a failed 6MT Centre Differential Viscous Coupling that they would like to donate to science?
I am preparing to start a diff rebuilding operation that would be beneficial to all forum members.
Cheers!

Look at this post viewtopic.php?f=45&t=30784

I wish I did! We've been waiting for someone to actually do this.

Good luck though. And thank u on behalf of everyone :D
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby BillyCorgi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:54 pm

Thanks Tom,

I am ready to go once the silicone arrives from the USA.
I am looking for the first donor differential and then also looking for the first guinea pig to try a heavily discounted trial unit?
(Guinea Pig in a real nice way)
Any takers out there?
Get your Short Shift Adaptor viewtopic.php?f=68&t=30525
Get your Gear Shift Rejuvenation Kit viewtopic.php?f=68&t=31240
Get your Centre Differential Rebuild viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31089
Want a custom built Brake Cylinder Stopper? viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31321
Need to hire a Guard Rolling Machine? viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31899
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby synoptica » Wed Sep 02, 2015 3:21 pm

tom_kauf wrote:The reverse switch is excellent....so far. As soon as the gearbox goes into reverse, the lights come on. No matter how much I wiggle the gear shifter, the lights remain on. Hopefully it stays that way.


Fingers crossed for you mate! I've just had to replace mine too (I bought the box to fit to my Foz, didn't realise the reverse switch was broken when I got it) :(

A bit dismayed to find that it seems to be a very common issue... and at ~70 bucks for a replacement, it's an obscene cost for the most basic of components (and a pig of a job to replace, at least when crammed into the Foz trans tunnel!)
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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby HardwareBoB » Wed Sep 02, 2015 3:52 pm

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Re: Centre Diff Binding

Postby synoptica » Wed Sep 02, 2015 4:22 pm

That's not as bad! Bloody stealership pricing :(

Sadly I had to bite the bullet and get it done as it was holding up a bunch of other work with the gearbox half hanging out, didn't quite have time to wait for shipping!
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