Engine hesitation/flat spot (Liberty 2.0R)

[gen4cruiser]

Can anyone clarify if the hesitation they are talking about is the same as what my car just started doing? Was driving to uni today as usual, but after leaving a school zone at 40 I put my foot down and nothing happened for a good couple of seconds and then it changed gear and went on its way. The entire rest of the trip was the same, with varying levels of the loss of power from slow take off at the lights to actually flooring it uphill and not even seeing much of a change on the tacho. My initial impression was problems with the gearbox, but just wanted to see if it's the same sensation everyone else is having.

[davejones2]

The problem that's been discussed on here is very specific: It's felt as a loss of power or "hesitation" between a certain rev range (usually 2100-3000 rpm, but can vary) with normal performance either side of this. The engine remains smooth throughout. Feels kind of like removing the "turbo" from a turbodiesel engine between a particular rev range. Its due to the timing being retarded for a reason(s) not entirely clear.

Has anyone tried the EGR valve cleaning fix yet?!

[klam]

I've tried to do it myself today but failed miserably as I couldn't access one bolt ... and I've also realized there are 2 EGR valves ?! One right one left, can anyone confirm? As you can guess, flatspots back in business on my car, despite the new o2 sensor haven't lasted long, it appeared again after a longer drive (2h+) and most of it on cruise control. Can actually be anything wrong with the ECM ?

[Kormoran]

My update; Car is a POS and its time to upgrade. Im over it

Unless someone awesome whom I will buy many MANY beers can work out why our 2.0r's are so shiiit!

[klam]

if anyone interested, I've created another thread related to the EGR valves removal / clean up http://forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=24259

And btw, I've put my car for sale as well, it's just this EGR I'm going to try and that's it.

[Kormoran]

After seeing many recommendations, the beast is booked in at John French Motors tomorrow afternoon.

Had a chat with one of the staff and they believe it could be still something as simple as the throttle body needing a really thorough cleaning as it can interfere with the butterfly. I did try this myself but as they've had successful results from performing this on the Impreza 2.0r's as well as Liberty's I figured it's worth a shot. Will let everyone know.

[calais]

My update; Car is a POS and its time to upgrade. Im over it

Unless someone awesome whom I will buy many MANY beers can work out why our 2.0r's are so shiiit!

I am glad to say, after many, many, many long nights of wondering how to turn my wife's 2.0R from a hesitating heap of **** into something that it always should of been, I can state categorically that it is the EGR that makes them run like dogs. Full credit to KLAM for putting the idea out there, it reminded me of issues with Holden's, Mitsubishi's and Audi's that I had worked on years ago which all had somewhat linked symptoms..............

I swapped between two EGR's..... one original that was always on the car, and one brand new one. I just happened to have the correct shapes and types of tools to be able to remove the EGR without needing to touch the alternator at all. It turns out to be a 10 minute job if the engine isn't hot.

I could swap between them and the faults returned with the dirty one and disappeared with the new one, so I cleaned the old one over a two day soak in carby cleaner and a set of metal brushes which I made to clean the valve, spring and seat and refitted it. Its now been 4000km of trouble free, smooth and 'powerful' running.

Win.

I was already making arrangements to sell the car, but honestly couldn't have sold it and been able to lay straight in bed knowing I had sold an honestly un-driveable car. However, my wife and I will now be keeping the car for a while longer yet. We just like it.

On another note..... the average fuel economy has dropped from an average of 9.2L/100km to 7.2L/100km! Just goes to show how badly we were trying to 'drive' around the hesitation.

If anyone in Sydney/Parramatta would like help with this, I am happy to assist.

[klam]

Eeeeeh good on you mate, and to be honest it was not my idea at all, I've just tried it as an option that was mentioned here at forum before to see if it fixes the problem. Unfortunately, it didn't work for me. I've cleaned the egr valve but in 3 days the flatspot was back. It's fakin frustrating but,we all know that already... And I'm where i was before and thinking of selling it but I'm too fighting my conscience..

what carby cleaner you have used?

[calais]

G'day KLAM,

I used a cocktail of aircraft solvents and decoking agents, but I also fully stripped the valve down. Removing the electronic actuator and all.

I felt the key was to let the body of the valve soak in the solvent cocktail for a few days to soften the deposits and then scrub the hell out of the valve, spring and seat.

In being able to do this, I did find that a positively silly amount of carbon and what-not did come out in the solvent. And when it went back together looked pretty much like the new one.

I'll call my mate at Subaru and see how much a brand new EGR might cost by way of comparison for the thread

My car did also however in the preceeding 5,000km gain a full 100,000km service where I did the following;

Oil, Air and Fuel filters (the in tank pump was fun, learning something new right there)
Mobil 1 5w30 Extended Range Oil (Courtesy of GL Lubricants)
New Gates timing belt kit including tensioner.
New exedy clutch and single mass flywheel (The dual-mass was worn, rattly and to be honest, a waste of money to replace)
Cleaned MAF and Throttle Body
Inspected brakes and suspension bushes

And coming up are the shifter bushes........

[Jeffreyy]

Hi all, I am from Sydney and have the same problem with my Subaru 2.0r. I was just wondering did Egr valve replacement or cleaned egr valve fix the hesitation for good? Cause I have so far replaced knock sensor, O2 sensor, spark plugs, cleaned maf and used upper body cleaner in the throttle body.thanks

[klam]

Hi all, I am from Sydney and have the same problem with my Subaru 2.0r. I was just wondering did Egr valve replacement or cleaned egr valve fix the hesitation for good? Cause I have so far replaced knock sensor, O2 sensor, spark plugs, cleaned maf and used upper body cleaner in the throttle body.thanks

I've cleaned it and it didn't help. I'm booked for the diagnostic tomorrow to see what guys at DENLO Subaru have got to say. I don't think they will find anything but one might never know. Currently my car has such a flatspot that it's nearly embarrassing to be sitting behind the wheel.. I'll give the EGR another chance by cleaning it and then possibly buying a new one. Then the fuel filter and then that's it. Car for sale (unfortunately)

[Jeffreyy]

Let us know the outcome mate thanks!:) was is hard to clean? how much is a new egr valve? I used a mates Bluetooth and android device which said it maf sensor and the air intake temperature sensor! But I have drove the car with no maf sensor and the problem I still there! Does anyone know where the ait sensor is located!

[dmh87]

It sucks to hear that we're all still suffering from this.
Keen to hear how much the EGR valve replacement would be from Subaru.

From my experience in the past in the past few months - is that it hasn't happened as often as it used to. I do quite a bit of highway driving with cruise on/off at various times and in the back of mind had assumed that there was a fair bit of carbon build up due to continuous long drives. The hesitation does kick in say 1 out of 3 long drives (between 4-8 hours driving), but it does resume after a bit of normal city driving. It also kicks in occasionally when the weather is quite warm and humid.

After hearing calais' experiences cleaning/replacing the EGR valve I might have to give that a go sometime this summer.
Look forward to everyone's experiences.

[Jeffreyy]

Has anyone tuned there car to see if it helps? Not the pak update!

[Deep Heat]

Has anyone tuned there car to see if it helps? Not the pak update!

Our ECU's can't be tuned.