Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

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Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:33 pm

Hi all,

I've lurked on this forum for a while, and it is a greats source of information. So though I may as well introduce the thing that matter, my car a rather boring stock looking gen 5 liberty(I personally like that it looks stock basically bar exhaust tips being slightly larger than stock with a Invidia Q300 exhaust).

About a 2 years ago it had the big end bearing go, at 187000km - it was using oil prior, and had a tune (which probably contributed to quicker wear, but made the care more enjoyable than stock- done by HPF in Dandenong which moved the power from 148-> 158awkw but peak power coming in a earlier in the rev band and about 30% more torque over stock which was noticable).

Pondering what to do, and there being not many manual family sized cars available, decided to get engine rebuilt and upgrade a few thing. I tried GotItRex in Melbourne(which is where I'm near), they didn't return calls, nor when I did call them want to do anything with a Gen V, ADS up in Sydney responded to my inquiries(spent quite a bit of time prior to commiting giving options to engine build- Isaac spent a lot of time answering questions), so ended up getting the car shipped up to Sydney to ADS for rebuild and modifications. They did a good job (they weren't cheap but aim was to get reliable power, and I guess that doesn't come cheap), building a closed deck EJ255 with STi W25 exhaust cams (which was suggestion from US Legacy forum). Moved to a GTPumps 3.5LM (low mount) and PSR headers (for the FA20!), Process West Verti-Cooler , 1300cc injectors, TGV deletes, a surge tank, and quite a few other things.

A strengthened (new ISF treated and shot peened gears) version of the split case 6 speed manual was an experiment (which given satogixxer's experience which I read too late, but at time couldn't afford upgrade, nor was I getting his figures), that didn't work - 2nd gear stripped a cog mid gear :? So now she has a STi 6 speed in her with R180 diff at back (rear running STi drive shafts, front still running originals, have to move to STi hubs etc for running STi front shafts). On the original ECU (EcuTek flashed) - the car made 312awkw and 600 NM torque at 3700, now moved to a MoTeC with a slight decrease in peak power, at 300 awkw, but power comes in earlier (still awaiting dyno-queen graph post upgrade). Boost comes in well prior to hitting 3000rpm. It is rather drivable.

Anyway, hi all, and thank you for all the awesome information this far, hope I can contribute to it! Happy to go further into my what was done(as there were quite a lot of things done to get the car to that point), but I think this is a long enough introduction.
Attachments
liberty_3.jpg
liberty_3.jpg (149.14 KiB) Viewed 714 times
liberty_2.jpg
Engine bay
liberty_2.jpg (203.23 KiB) Viewed 714 times
liberty_1.jpg
Standard Gen V wagon
liberty_1.jpg (200.72 KiB) Viewed 714 times
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JAWolf
 
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby marcus.bspec » Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:25 pm

awesome work mate those are some really good numbers, my current motor was built by ADS, no dramas so far, they do a great job!
2007 Subaru Liberty GT Spec B | 6MT Wagon | instagram.com/marcus.bspec

2019.06.20 - 146 kw atw
(tune booked OCT 2020)
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby nay » Sat Aug 01, 2020 11:50 pm

Wow, now this is an epic build! :D :D. If I remember correctly I think I saw this car featured on ADS' Facebook page. They uploaded a video showing the underside of the car after the STI 6 speed swap, very cool!.

If you don't mind me asking, do you roughly know how much the 6 speed swap was? I've always wanted to eventually do this, and I'm curious how much ADS charges (I know it's a lot haha).
[MY14 Liberty GT 6MT]: Tuned by MSR Engineering | Invidia Q300 TBE | Whiteline F + R Sway Bar Kit | Exedy HD Clutch | DBA T2 | Intima SR | GFB Respons BOV | Perrin Short Shifter Package
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:36 am

Nay,

On the price I will only say it is more than the car is worth stock 2nd hand (at current prices), it was an first for ADS and I'm guessing future people doing will get it at a better price than I paid(being their first Gen V conversion, labor costs higher,and also had some discounts due to previous transmission). They are worth getting in contact with, they should be able to give you a quote (again more accurately than a first time- I didn't really have much options bar de-tuning and getting transmission fixed OR going TY856). I went in to the shot peened/ISF stock box knowing that it won't be warranted for the power produced.

I can give you the good and the not so great for , at least my Gen V, with the TY856.

Great is: shift quality is awesome and should be stronger than original transmission.
Good is: it appears to be sturdy, and torsen lsd is nice, 6th revs at 2250 at 100 instead of 2400 rpm
Not so great (but expected): more vibration transferred into the cabin - so if you are looking for a quiet drive this isn't something you want

Also: with a twin plate clutch, lots of noise when clutch in + lightened flywheel = easier to stall.

If you are sticking to under 250awkw I think the shot peened and isf treated gearbox is a better option (more refined and gear shift was greatly improved over when I bought the car new)- ie doing what I did without the E85 option (that was giving approx 240awkw).

Side note: E85 at present is expensive and fuel economy is about 15l/100km on highway/country backroads (with overtaking), and lastly it is annoying to start on cold mornings!
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby nay » Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:14 pm

Thanks for the in-depth info. I didn't even realise yours was the first Gen V conversion they did! I've always enjoyed the STI 6-Speed shifting feel compared to the stock gen V one, but I gather it isn't worth it unless STI Swapping becomes more popular. I'll definitely get in contact with ADS if I decide to upgrade the stock gearbox, they seem to be the only ones who are willing to work on gen Vs haha.
[MY14 Liberty GT 6MT]: Tuned by MSR Engineering | Invidia Q300 TBE | Whiteline F + R Sway Bar Kit | Exedy HD Clutch | DBA T2 | Intima SR | GFB Respons BOV | Perrin Short Shifter Package
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:13 pm

Marcus.bspec - thank you. In hind sight I'd rather your series of Liberty (much better choices for mods, and less custom work needed for an arguably better looking car to start with). Going into this it was a bit of unknown and went past original budget, I guess it is "unique" (being a wagon), and I like the "ugly" Subaru's (my other one I had was an MY02 STi many years back and that was considered again the "ugly" series)
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:22 pm

Nay - firstly you vehicle looks awesome (like looking through your build pics).

I think ADS worked out things in the project that will make future conversions better, and better in cost too. I do hope to go full hubs + brakes too in the future (sadly that will mean foregoing the wagon wheels and absolute sleeper look)

Hindsight wise a 98 tune with same turbo as I have would have been a sensible option with the 6 speed. It is a shame you can't use the PPG 1-3 gear set for the 5 speed split case box in the 6 speed, as something like that would be best of both worlds. A strong gearset for the weaker gears (2nd 3rd), whilst retaining the quietness of the car (bar straight cut gears whine at low speeds and overtaking).
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby bigBADbenny » Thu Sep 10, 2020 8:48 am

Awesome build!
Which upgrade 6mt did you get?
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:17 pm

bigBADbenny wrote:Awesome build!
Which upgrade 6mt did you get?


Ended up going for long ratio, based on gears from gen 4 spec b, with helical LSD at front and torsen LSD at back. For what it's worth, I could have chosen whatever gear set based on available ones, as the box was basically a custom build, but the spec b ratios seemed to make most sense, 6th now is 2300 at 100kmh Vs 2450. Once again the gears were ISF treated and shot peened in the hope they are as strong as possible (really want that to be it for transmission. The original box "upgrade" was an experiment which I understood the risks. This option is warranted. ADS has been good with support this far)
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby bigBADbenny » Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:34 pm

Wow, nice upgrade and does it have a dccd centre diff, uprated vlscd or stock lgt centre diff?

Great to have a proper 6mt in there, that’s just you and member satogixxer that’s made the big jump, which iirc involves quite some custom work due to the GenV engine mount setup.

Hopefully the non warranty job on the 5+1 upgrade wasn’t too much of a financial cul de sac :shock:
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:50 pm

bigBADbenny wrote:Wow, nice upgrade and does it have a dccd centre diff, uprated vlscd or stock lgt centre diff?

Great to have a proper 6mt in there, that’s just you and member satogixxer that’s made the big jump, which iirc involves quite some custom work due to the GenV engine mount setup.

Hopefully the non warranty job on the 5+1 upgrade wasn’t too much of a financial cul de sac :shock:


Got the 20kg viscous coupling, no DCCD, ironically if I read Satogixxers posts I would have asked for less power, and just go non-flex. At the time the stock box was my only option, due to budget, and I was ignorant to what power levels they can handle (I was suggested against keeping at 300awkw, but I made the choice to keep it that way, and use that mode as, it was/is fun. I was suggested to go 250 awkw).

It is still quick on the 22 psi boost (s mode), 16 psi boost is pretty brisk too(I mode), haven't used 27 psi mode post going the MoTeC (when I looked at data log could see boost was at 22 then looked at tune and realised s# is only mode with 27 psi, and I've not really used that since I went down that path) ... Have to say I'm thoroughly impressed with the after market ECU (basically get 23 hours of detailed logging in 240 MB)
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby bigBADbenny » Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:03 am

That’s really quite the weapon!
That’s a ton of data, post a cloud link to a log, I’d love to take a peek :good:

Megalog Viewer can easily handle a 1mb log, I’d like to see what happens with eg 50mb or more lol...
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby satogixxer » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:39 pm

I haven't caught up on the forums for a long time and probably have about a years worth of unread posts to read... just stumbled upon this by chance though and glad I did!

Wow - well done mate, great build. :good:

Did not realise anyone else had gone down a similar path to me with the Gen V (masochist much?).

Drawing from my own experience I imagine it may have been somewhat painful + expensive to get this point... but the result looks worth it.

Love the Sleeper Pro+++ spec to be honest. I'm sure you've surprised a few people! :D

Well done and enjoy it, and I honestly hope it stays more reliable than mine (I need one of those tally boards.... xxx days without incident - although for once I can thankfully say that number would be nearing 365 for probably the 1st time ever).
[Liberty GT MY10 6MT]: STI bits | STI Brembo's + Dixcel | DAMD D-shape | Cusco coilovers & sways | HKS LA clutch | BLITZ pod | Plazmaman FMIC | Deshele built EJ25 | Emtron ECU | BorgWarner EFR 7670 | 350kw atw
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:03 pm

bigBADbenny wrote:That’s really quite the weapon!
That’s a ton of data, post a cloud link to a log, I’d love to take a peek :good:

Megalog Viewer can easily handle a 1mb log, I’d like to see what happens with eg 50mb or more lol...


To view logs you need the MoTeC i2 software (unless Megalog can view .ld files, which seems like MoTeC's file (can be downloaded from https://www.motec.com.au/software/latestreleases/ )

This is what the interface looks like (I can link the file to if you do wish to download the i2 software, or try in Megalog)
i2_page1.jpg
i2_page1.jpg (237.61 KiB) Viewed 366 times


Note the name of file from the UI- basically the timing belt stripped a few teeth... and my counter as per Satogixxer's post my car would be 0 days between car being off road - hoping tomorrow to get her back with a better timing belt fitted - which due to Aust Post "express" being slow arrived a week after being sent from Sydney (it is running "street" rated valve springs , so unsure why the Subaru belt didn't hold after 10k). On that note when I rang on the day the issue happened, basically had no hesitation from ADS to a) talk through diagnosis + b) take steps needed to get car back on road (local mechanic has done timing belt fitment/verification as shipping the car to Sydney would be frustrating) - so as yet can't really fault them.

So we will see how things go either tomorrow or Monday (at present the car being an issue is an annoyance, compared to other life stuff it isn't big in the scheme of things. Thankfully on transport side I have an old 100 series Landcruiser to use in meanwhile)
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Re: Member Profile - jawolf's MY12 Gen V Liberty GT

Postby JAWolf » Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:38 pm

satogixxer wrote:I haven't caught up on the forums for a long time and probably have about a years worth of unread posts to read... just stumbled upon this by chance though and glad I did!

Wow - well done mate, great build. :good:

Did not realise anyone else had gone down a similar path to me with the Gen V (masochist much?).

Drawing from my own experience I imagine it may have been somewhat painful + expensive to get this point... but the result looks worth it.

Love the Sleeper Pro+++ spec to be honest. I'm sure you've surprised a few people! :D

Well done and enjoy it, and I honestly hope it stays more reliable than mine (I need one of those tally boards.... xxx days without incident - although for once I can thankfully say that number would be nearing 365 for probably the 1st time ever).

'
Firstly, a massive thank you Satogixxer for your build post, as at least I knew there was an option post original box failing- so thank you for the invaluable information (and you do have a most amazing build, looks great both from a figures and visual standpoint).

It seems like the Gen V modding people are definitely masochists. My view was where do I get a manual family sized awd wagon? There wasn't any I could find so I thought I'd (misguidedly?) try and make something more out of what I had(and I do seem to have a penchant for the less loved Subaru series, had a bug eyed MY02 STi, again arguably the least pretty Subaru!). It was expensive , and as yet my time with the car has been about 8500km of driving (4500km to kill shot peened/isf treated box , and 4000km once back to get to stripped timing belt - being replaced with Tomei one). Hopefully after this fix I'll be able to shoot for a year of trouble free (mechanically) driving too. So currently at 0 days since last incident (does the counter only start once you get the vehicle back )

Glad you are at a point of being over the painful hump - that is what I like to hear, hope you are enjoying the vehicle. Your build was a great read. I hope you are enjoying track days and daily driving, and would love to see a video of one of the track days if you do ever get video of it (once this Covid stuff is done and given the car a good run , I'd love to do a track day).

Curious do you get more vibration through the vehicle since going to the TY856(for me I get some between 2300-2800 under load, might try and work out if there is anything I can do to reduce)? My car will generally be a two tone paint due to living on a dirt road - so I don't even try to get the exterior looking nice (might try cleaning it if I need some rain for the water tanks though)
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