club.liberty.asn.au

satogixxer wrote:Hey mate, sorry to hear about this, hope you get it sorted. I'd wait for a proper diagnosis from a competent mechanic before going down the engine build path - maybe you'll get lucky!

Yes your right, I'll definitely find out what the issue is before going into a build.

Did the knock sound vary based on engine RPM or no?

Surge wrote:Did the knock sound vary based on engine RPM or no?

When I started the car up and the knock was very bad, I revved the engine in idle and the knock would get faster and faster based on the revs if that makes sense

From your description it doesn't sound promising.

Did it sound anything like this?

satogixxer wrote:From your description it doesn't sound promising.

Did it sound anything like this?

Deeper knocking sound and not as fast on idle, but close enough

MadmanSean wrote:

Surge wrote:Pull the sump off and look for metal.

If needing to rebuild the engine, are you going with any upgrades ? Closed deck etc?

I'm not familiar with GenV's, is it possible to remove the sump wile engine is in the car?

Closed deck would be awesome! but i doubt the Auto could handle that power potential Haha

spoke to kewish automatics in Melbourne, very helpful guy, he can build a tough transmission, but 400kw is pushing it, he is not sure, and even then he said the center diff becomes the weak spot, and me being an aggressive driver , he feels he can't give me what i want. It seems there is noone around pushing 400kw on an auto reliably for over 1.5-2 years after speaking to a few shops. hmmm, bit of a dilemma

Niz22 wrote: I know mick (dr20) had a full auto tranny 5EAT rebuild , just not sure how it held up , for how long and who did it. Ive tried contacting him.

I can answer that for you. It didn't hold up very well at all. Recently dismantled it - and it had a number of issues. Centre diff output shaft was already missing a few teeth - and this was cryo treated/shot peened/linished/scanned for cracks - and only done "5000kms" to quote Mick.

The clutch packs had some issues, fluid was really really black, which apparently contaminated the clutch packs further. Box also showed signs of not being assembled properly.

What does this mean for you - can an auto hold 400kw safely? The box/clutches probably can. The c diff won't, especially if you're like Mick and you try launching it. The broken bits of the gear teeth will also float around the entire system and likely damage sensors and the VB.

"Just convert it to a manual, 6 speeds are bullet proof!" - check out Satogixxer's build. His manual isn't fairing very well at all at 400kw, and even a proper 6 speed setup like a gen4 or Sti will be stretched at 400kw, at the very least you'd easily break driveshafts on a launch.

400kw 4 cylinder Subaru engines are also not the best idea. It takes a lot to get there, and might not last very long. And I'm not talking about cars that read 400kw on a dyno, but then run the same MPH as a 300kw car.

If I was you - I'd be aiming for 300kwatw - your car will be happy with it from the engine and driveline side of things. What is the point in having a 400kw powerplant, when something breaks every time you drive it? MCM built a 270kw 3.6L turbo H6 setup, and with stripped interior managed a 122MPH, and beat an R35. In a proper 300kw Lib - you should be seeing 125MPH in full street trim - which is a mid 11 second car, and chops R35s - and realistically - what more do you need from a family wagon?

alexeiwoody wrote:

Niz22 wrote: I know mick (dr20) had a full auto tranny 5EAT rebuild , just not sure how it held up , for how long and who did it. Ive tried contacting him.

I can answer that for you. It didn't hold up very well at all. Recently dismantled it - and it had a number of issues. Centre diff output shaft was already missing a few teeth - and this was cryo treated/shot peened/linished/scanned for cracks - and only done "5000kms" to quote Mick.

The clutch packs had some issues, fluid was really really black, which apparently contaminated the clutch packs further. Box also showed signs of not being assembled properly.

What does this mean for you - can an auto hold 400kw safely? The box/clutches probably can. The c diff won't, especially if you're like Mick and you try launching it. The broken bits of the gear teeth will also float around the entire system and likely damage sensors and the VB.

"Just convert it to a manual, 6 speeds are bullet proof!" - check out Satogixxer's build. His manual isn't fairing very well at all at 400kw, and even a proper 6 speed setup like a gen4 or Sti will be stretched at 400kw, at the very least you'd easily break driveshafts on a launch.

400kw 4 cylinder Subaru engines are also not the best idea. It takes a lot to get there, and might not last very long. And I'm not talking about cars that read 400kw on a dyno, but then run the same MPH as a 300kw car.

If I was you - I'd be aiming for 300kwatw - your car will be happy with it from the engine and driveline side of things. What is the point in having a 400kw powerplant, when something breaks every time you drive it? MCM built a 270kw 3.6L turbo H6 setup, and with stripped interior managed a 122MPH, and beat an R35. In a proper 300kw Lib - you should be seeing 125MPH in full street trim - which is a mid 11 second car, and chops R35s - and realistically - what more do you need from a family wagon?

appreciate the input, you definitely make sense , and we always think about things from that perspective but i guess we try to push as much as we can, and suffer later because of it.
i am going to pm you some questions if you dont mind checking it out shortly. thanks.

Agreed, go for a less insane power figure. 300KW is more than enough for the street mate. Also consider drive-ability. Better to have less power but more usable spread. I've driven with GT-Rs that have 400+KW and are absolutely shit in the twisties as they are either too much of a handful or they are off boost and lag. Straights are a different story of course Spend the extra on braking and handling.

norbs wrote:Agreed, go for a less insane power figure. 300KW is more than enough for the street mate. Also consider drive-ability. Better to have less power but more usable spread. I've driven with GT-Rs that have 400+KW and are absolutely shit in the twisties as they are either too much of a handful or they are off boost and lag. Straights are a different story of course Spend the extra on braking and handling.

putting cost aside, if i build a 400kw engine, atleast i have that added safety, also i have 3 modes of power to choose from, im assuming the low mode will be around the 280kw mark or so.

Niz22 wrote:

MadmanSean wrote:

Surge wrote:Pull the sump off and look for metal.

If needing to rebuild the engine, are you going with any upgrades ? Closed deck etc?

I'm not familiar with GenV's, is it possible to remove the sump wile engine is in the car?

Closed deck would be awesome! but i doubt the Auto could handle that power potential Haha

spoke to kewish automatics in Melbourne, very helpful guy, he can build a tough transmission, but 400kw is pushing it, he is not sure, and even then he said the center diff becomes the weak spot, and me being an aggressive driver , he feels he can't give me what i want. It seems there is noone around pushing 400kw on an auto reliably for over 1.5-2 years after speaking to a few shops. hmmm, bit of a dilemma

The build might be 400kw but it's the torque figure that the transmission has to deal with - what was Kewish's view on how much torque the transmission could take?

Dont bother with an Auto for over 250kw at the wheels, I broke 2 built autos in 2 years........with 265kw at the wheels

waste of time and over $10,000 blown - learn from my experience.

should have gone over to 6 speed manual that is in it now straight away.

Currently running 283kw (380hp) at the wheels now and I can advise even this is plenty for the street.
While I can go higher it means heavier clutches which are not good for daily driving.

Just my 2 cents

jslayz wrote:Dont bother with an Auto for over 250kw at the wheels, I broke 2 built autos in 2 years........with 265kw at the wheels

waste of time and over $10,000 blown - learn from my experience.

should have gone over to 6 speed manual that is in it now straight away.

Currently running 283kw (380hp) at the wheels now and I can advise even this is plenty for the street.
While I can go higher it means heavier clutches which are not good for daily driving.

Just my 2 cents

yeh not looking good with the autos at over 250kw reliably. Problem is i don't know of anyone who has done the manual swap in the Gen V, Firstly i think it will be very very costly and there may need to be body fab work to fit it and also the ecu may need changing. All drive subaru had a customer who had a lib 4 auto at about 290kw, it had a built auto with them which lasted a few years but as soon as they just tweeked it to over 300kw it broke, They built an even stronger one and it broke again. Now he is doing the sti 6 speed conversion.

Thanks for the advice - it's a shame to hear that as I was looking to potentially rebuild the transmission to strengthen it and then do more power mods but I'll definitely take it on board. This advice puts a stopper to any of those plans.
I always thought it's the torque not the power that kills the tranny - where as you are referring to your power figures?
What torque did the car make back then (out of interest what does it make now?)

I like a manual for the weekend but have got used to a semi-auto for stop start commuter traffic.

Roh

Smashed 2nd center diff with this.